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IE 9

Discussion in 'Windows 7' started by Boscoe, Oct 11, 2010.

  1. Boscoe

    Boscoe Flightless Bird

    The new Beta release of IE9 is here, and IÂ’'ve been using it for a few
    weeks with no problems. Seems to be reasonably stable and trouble-free
    but it won't run on XP, but you may get it to run under Vista. ItÂ’s a
    lot cleaner with a major cull of menus and toolbars, leaving more space
    for web pages. Many of the shiny new features are under the bonnet and
    concerned with future developments...

    <http://www.beautyoftheweb.com/#/productguide/top-features>
     
  2. Ken Blake

    Ken Blake Flightless Bird

    On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 19:51:46 +0100, Boscoe <laughingboy47@hotmail.com>
    wrote:

    > The new Beta release of IE9 is here, and I?'ve been using it for a few
    > weeks with no problems. Seems to be reasonably stable and trouble-free



    OK, but here's my standard message re beta software:

    All that exists of IE9 is a beta test version of it. The reason it's a
    beta test version instead of a released version is that it still has
    bugs in it, and Microsoft is looking for beta test users to inform
    them of other bugs as they are found,

    In my view, unless you have a spare computer to install it on, and
    enjoy doing beta testing of software and reporting of bugs to
    Microsoft, installing such beta software is just looking for trouble.

    Yes, you can install the beta version, but for almost everyone I
    strongly advise *against* doing that, and waiting for it to be
    released.
     
  3. Charles Tomaras

    Charles Tomaras Flightless Bird

    "Ken Blake" <kblake@kb.invalid> wrote in message
    news:fmo6b65niucq368ap23bneeh7r39tsaa9k@4ax.com...
    > On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 19:51:46 +0100, Boscoe <laughingboy47@hotmail.com>
    > wrote:
    >
    >> The new Beta release of IE9 is here, and I?'ve been using it for a few
    >> weeks with no problems. Seems to be reasonably stable and trouble-free

    >
    >
    > OK, but here's my standard message re beta software:
    >
    > All that exists of IE9 is a beta test version of it. The reason it's a
    > beta test version instead of a released version is that it still has
    > bugs in it, and Microsoft is looking for beta test users to inform
    > them of other bugs as they are found,
    >
    > In my view, unless you have a spare computer to install it on, and
    > enjoy doing beta testing of software and reporting of bugs to
    > Microsoft, installing such beta software is just looking for trouble.
    >
    > Yes, you can install the beta version, but for almost everyone I
    > strongly advise *against* doing that, and waiting for it to be
    > released.


    Well...the kind of bugs that might be found in a beta of this sort are not
    generally the critical types of bugs. This software has had more people
    hours of beta testing already than most released applications ever get. This
    is all about web site compatibility, UI and performance tweaking. How many
    millions of downloads now and how many "critical" issues? This is pretty
    safe stuff.
     
  4. Ken Blake

    Ken Blake Flightless Bird

    On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 13:10:52 -0700, "Charles Tomaras"
    <tomaras@tomaras.com> wrote:

    >
    > "Ken Blake" <kblake@kb.invalid> wrote in message
    > news:fmo6b65niucq368ap23bneeh7r39tsaa9k@4ax.com...
    > > On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 19:51:46 +0100, Boscoe <laughingboy47@hotmail.com>
    > > wrote:
    > >
    > >> The new Beta release of IE9 is here, and I?'ve been using it for a few
    > >> weeks with no problems. Seems to be reasonably stable and trouble-free

    > >
    > >
    > > OK, but here's my standard message re beta software:
    > >
    > > All that exists of IE9 is a beta test version of it. The reason it's a
    > > beta test version instead of a released version is that it still has
    > > bugs in it, and Microsoft is looking for beta test users to inform
    > > them of other bugs as they are found,
    > >
    > > In my view, unless you have a spare computer to install it on, and
    > > enjoy doing beta testing of software and reporting of bugs to
    > > Microsoft, installing such beta software is just looking for trouble.
    > >
    > > Yes, you can install the beta version, but for almost everyone I
    > > strongly advise *against* doing that, and waiting for it to be
    > > released.

    >
    > Well...the kind of bugs that might be found in a beta of this sort are not
    > generally the critical types of bugs. This software has had more people
    > hours of beta testing already than most released applications ever get. This
    > is all about web site compatibility, UI and performance tweaking. How many
    > millions of downloads now and how many "critical" issues? This is pretty
    > safe stuff.



    Might it be somewhat safer than other types of beta software? Yes,
    probably. Does that means it's entirely safe? No, it doesn't.

    Your choice. I'll continue to recommend against it, as I recommend
    against all beta software, "unless you have a spare computer to
    install it on, and enjoy doing beta testing of software and reporting
    of bugs to Microsoft."
     
  5. Dave \Crash\ Dummy

    Dave \Crash\ Dummy Flightless Bird

    Ken Blake wrote:
    > On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 19:51:46 +0100, Boscoe
    > <laughingboy47@hotmail.com> wrote:
    >
    >> The new Beta release of IE9 is here, and I?'ve been using it for a
    >> few weeks with no problems. Seems to be reasonably stable and
    >> trouble-free

    >
    >
    > OK, but here's my standard message re beta software:
    >
    > All that exists of IE9 is a beta test version of it. The reason it's
    > a beta test version instead of a released version is that it still
    > has bugs in it, and Microsoft is looking for beta test users to
    > inform them of other bugs as they are found,
    >
    > In my view, unless you have a spare computer to install it on, and
    > enjoy doing beta testing of software and reporting of bugs to
    > Microsoft, installing such beta software is just looking for trouble.
    >
    >
    > Yes, you can install the beta version, but for almost everyone I
    > strongly advise *against* doing that, and waiting for it to be
    > released.


    My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a multibillion
    dollar corporation for free.
    --
    Crash

    "When you get to a fork in the road, take it."
    ~ Yogi Berra ~
     
  6. Boscoe

    Boscoe Flightless Bird

    On 11/10/2010 8:18 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
    > On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 19:51:46 +0100, Boscoe<laughingboy47@hotmail.com>
    > wrote:
    >
    >> The new Beta release of IE9 is here, and I?'ve been using it for a few
    >> weeks with no problems. Seems to be reasonably stable and trouble-free

    >
    >
    > OK, but here's my standard message re beta software:
    >
    > All that exists of IE9 is a beta test version of it. The reason it's a
    > beta test version instead of a released version is that it still has
    > bugs in it, and Microsoft is looking for beta test users to inform
    > them of other bugs as they are found,
    >
    > In my view, unless you have a spare computer to install it on, and
    > enjoy doing beta testing of software and reporting of bugs to
    > Microsoft, installing such beta software is just looking for trouble.
    >
    > Yes, you can install the beta version, but for almost everyone I
    > strongly advise *against* doing that, and waiting for it to be
    > released.


    You use Beta on an at-your-own-risk basis, don't you? Of course you
    won't put it on your work computer. But, several million guinea pigs
    have given it a thorough road test to uncover any glitches.

    Windows 7 Beta version was one of the most popular downloads of all time.
     
  7. Art [artfudd] Folden

    Art [artfudd] Folden Flightless Bird

    While I agree in general with your advice, with MS’s new trend of releasing betas to the public
    instead of undergoing extensive private beta testing (any that is done is limited to a relative few
    compared to the more extensive techbeta testing done previously), seems to result in publicly
    released betas that have far fewer bugs than what in the past was released to private beta testers.
    In other words, I would not hesitate to put this kind of beta on a non-test machine, but would
    advise against putting it (or any beta) on a production-critical machine. So IMO your warnings do
    not fully apply with regard to the public betas like it did with the private betas that received
    much earlier beta versions. Just my thoughts and opinion..


    Art [artfudd] Folden
    I'm a PC and Windows 7 sux less!
    ): !tol a xus llits liaMLW tub..
    ----------------------------------------------
    "Ken Blake" <kblake@kb.invalid> wrote in message news:nfs6b6ldlbsc7bhjtnc8fo1ft49g1lq41m@4ax.com...
    On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 13:10:52 -0700, "Charles Tomaras"
    <tomaras@tomaras.com> wrote:

    >
    > "Ken Blake" <kblake@kb.invalid> wrote in message
    > news:fmo6b65niucq368ap23bneeh7r39tsaa9k@4ax.com...
    > > On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 19:51:46 +0100, Boscoe <laughingboy47@hotmail.com>
    > > wrote:
    > >
    > >> The new Beta release of IE9 is here, and I?'ve been using it for a few
    > >> weeks with no problems. Seems to be reasonably stable and trouble-free

    > >
    > >
    > > OK, but here's my standard message re beta software:
    > >
    > > All that exists of IE9 is a beta test version of it. The reason it's a
    > > beta test version instead of a released version is that it still has
    > > bugs in it, and Microsoft is looking for beta test users to inform
    > > them of other bugs as they are found,
    > >
    > > In my view, unless you have a spare computer to install it on, and
    > > enjoy doing beta testing of software and reporting of bugs to
    > > Microsoft, installing such beta software is just looking for trouble.
    > >
    > > Yes, you can install the beta version, but for almost everyone I
    > > strongly advise *against* doing that, and waiting for it to be
    > > released.

    >
    > Well...the kind of bugs that might be found in a beta of this sort are not
    > generally the critical types of bugs. This software has had more people
    > hours of beta testing already than most released applications ever get. This
    > is all about web site compatibility, UI and performance tweaking. How many
    > millions of downloads now and how many "critical" issues? This is pretty
    > safe stuff.



    Might it be somewhat safer than other types of beta software? Yes,
    probably. Does that means it's entirely safe? No, it doesn't.

    Your choice. I'll continue to recommend against it, as I recommend
    against all beta software, "unless you have a spare computer to
    install it on, and enjoy doing beta testing of software and reporting
    of bugs to Microsoft."
     
  8. mark

    mark Flightless Bird

    X-No-Archive: yes


    "Dave "Crash" Dummy" <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
    news:i9055p$s9p$1@news.eternal-september.org...

    > My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a multibillion
    > dollar corporation for free.


    Very commendable....
    another view, of course, for the same situation, is that this software
    (generally) comes free and one could view ironing out (this) free software
    as a benefit to the millions of other future users...??


    mark
     
  9. Dave \Crash\ Dummy

    Dave \Crash\ Dummy Flightless Bird

    mark wrote:
    > X-No-Archive: yes
    >
    >
    > "Dave "Crash" Dummy" <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
    > news:i9055p$s9p$1@news.eternal-september.org...
    >
    >> My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >> multibillion dollar corporation for free.

    >
    > Very commendable.... another view, of course, for the same situation,
    > is that this software (generally) comes free and one could view
    > ironing out (this) free software as a benefit to the millions of
    > other future users...??


    Free? Where did you get your copy of Windows 7 or Vista? I had to pay
    for mine. IE 9 is only available to Vista and Windows 7 owners. It may be
    included, but it is not free.
    --
    Crash

    Committed to the search for intraterrestrial intelligence.
     
  10. Jeff Layman

    Jeff Layman Flightless Bird

    On 12/10/2010 16:07, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >>> My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >>> multibillion dollar corporation for free.

    >>
    >> Very commendable.... another view, of course, for the same situation,
    >> is that this software (generally) comes free and one could view
    >> ironing out (this) free software as a benefit to the millions of
    >> other future users...??

    >
    > Free? Where did you get your copy of Windows 7 or Vista? I had to pay
    > for mine. IE 9 is only available to Vista and Windows 7 owners. It may be
    > included, but it is not free.


    That's an interesting observation. But does that make all "freeware"
    which doesn't run on a free OS misnamed? Is anything which will only
    run on Windows or a Mac really free?

    --

    Jeff
     
  11. Dave \Crash\ Dummy

    Dave \Crash\ Dummy Flightless Bird

    Jeff Layman wrote:
    > On 12/10/2010 16:07, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >>>> My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >>>> multibillion dollar corporation for free.
    >>>
    >>> Very commendable.... another view, of course, for the same
    >>> situation, is that this software (generally) comes free and one
    >>> could view ironing out (this) free software as a benefit to the
    >>> millions of other future users...??

    >>
    >> Free? Where did you get your copy of Windows 7 or Vista? I had to
    >> pay for mine. IE 9 is only available to Vista and Windows 7 owners.
    >> It may be included, but it is not free.

    >
    > That's an interesting observation. But does that make all "freeware"
    > which doesn't run on a free OS misnamed? Is anything which will
    > only run on Windows or a Mac really free?


    IE is not a third party add on. It is an integral part of the OS.

    I don't really want to get into a philosophical debate on what is or is not
    "freeware." I just stated my attitude towards beta testing MS software.
    You have my permission to disagree and install anything you want.
    --
    Crash

    "In politics, stupidity is not a handicap."
    ~ Napoleon Bonaparte ~
     
  12. mark

    mark Flightless Bird

    X-No-Archive: yes

    "Dave "Crash" Dummy" <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
    news:i929pe$ol8$1@news.eternal-september.org...
    > Jeff Layman wrote:
    >> On 12/10/2010 16:07, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >>>>> My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >>>>> multibillion dollar corporation for free.
    >>>>
    >>>> Very commendable.... another view, of course, for the same situation,
    >>>> is that this software (generally) comes free and one could view ironing
    >>>> out (this) free software as a benefit to the millions of other future
    >>>> users...??
    >>>
    >>> Free? Where did you get your copy of Windows 7 or Vista? I had to pay
    >>> for mine. IE 9 is only available to Vista and Windows 7 owners.
    >>> It may be included, but it is not free.

    >>
    >> That's an interesting observation. But does that make all "freeware"
    >> which doesn't run on a free OS misnamed? Is anything which will only
    >> run on Windows or a Mac really free?


    > IE is not a third party add on. It is an integral part of the OS.


    erm...certainly not in Europe it isn't... (ok, third party it isn't...but
    add on it is)
    Indeed, MS have had to allow the operating system to be free of IE by way of
    choosing a/any number of browsers.
    You can use MS windows but you DON'T have to use IE..

    > I don't really want to get into a philosophical debate on what is or is
    > not
    > "freeware." I just stated my attitude towards beta testing MS software.
    > You have my permission to disagree and install anything you want.


    ...but ignored the fact that IE IS free to download and use..


    mark
     
  13. Dave \Crash\ Dummy

    Dave \Crash\ Dummy Flightless Bird

    mark wrote:
    > X-No-Archive: yes
    >
    > "Dave "Crash" Dummy" <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
    > news:i929pe$ol8$1@news.eternal-september.org...
    >> Jeff Layman wrote:
    >>> On 12/10/2010 16:07, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >>>>>> My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >>>>>> multibillion dollar corporation for free.
    >>>>> Very commendable.... another view, of course, for the same
    >>>>> situation, is that this software (generally) comes free and
    >>>>> one could view ironing out (this) free software as a benefit
    >>>>> to the millions of other future users...??
    >>>> Free? Where did you get your copy of Windows 7 or Vista? I had
    >>>> to pay for mine. IE 9 is only available to Vista and Windows 7
    >>>> owners. It may be included, but it is not free.
    >>> That's an interesting observation. But does that make all
    >>> "freeware" which doesn't run on a free OS misnamed? Is anything
    >>> which will only run on Windows or a Mac really free?

    >
    >> IE is not a third party add on. It is an integral part of the OS.

    >
    > erm...certainly not in Europe it isn't... (ok, third party it
    > isn't...but add on it is) Indeed, MS have had to allow the operating
    > system to be free of IE by way of choosing a/any number of browsers.
    > You can use MS windows but you DON'T have to use IE..
    >
    >> I don't really want to get into a philosophical debate on what is
    >> or is not "freeware." I just stated my attitude towards beta
    >> testing MS software. You have my permission to disagree and install
    >> anything you want.

    >
    > ..but ignored the fact that IE IS free to download and use..


    Whether IE is free or not has nothing to do with my original statement:
    "My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    multibillion dollar corporation for free." The last I heard, MS is not a
    nonprofit corporation.
    --
    Crash

    "When you get to a fork in the road, take it."
    ~ Yogi Berra ~
     
  14. Boscoe

    Boscoe Flightless Bird

    On 13/10/2010 4:24 PM, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >
    > Whether IE is free or not has nothing to do with my original statement:
    > "My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    > multibillion dollar corporation for free." The last I heard, MS is not a
    > nonprofit corporation.



    So, haw much have you given to charity?


    <http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/microsoft/7893609/Microsoft-co-founder-Paul-Allen-gives-away-half-of-his-fortune.html>
     
  15. Alias

    Alias Flightless Bird

    On 10/13/2010 05:41 PM, Boscoe wrote:
    > On 13/10/2010 4:24 PM, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >>
    >> Whether IE is free or not has nothing to do with my original statement:
    >> "My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >> multibillion dollar corporation for free." The last I heard, MS is not a
    >> nonprofit corporation.

    >
    >
    > So, haw much have you given to charity?
    >
    >
    > <http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/microsoft/7893609/Microsoft-co-founder-Paul-Allen-gives-away-half-of-his-fortune.html>
    >
    >


    Yeah, but the other half will last him and twenty of his descendants for
    a long, long time. He gave it out of guilt, just like Gates and Buffet
    did. When they give ALL of their fortune to charity and start living out
    on the street, you'll have something. And Paul Allen won't let go of it
    until after he dies which gives him plenty of time to change his mind.

    --
    Alias
     
  16. Boscoe

    Boscoe Flightless Bird

    On 13/10/2010 4:45 PM, Alias wrote:
    > On 10/13/2010 05:41 PM, Boscoe wrote:
    >> On 13/10/2010 4:24 PM, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Whether IE is free or not has nothing to do with my original statement:
    >>> "My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >>> multibillion dollar corporation for free." The last I heard, MS is not a
    >>> nonprofit corporation.

    >>
    >>
    >> So, haw much have you given to charity?
    >>
    >>
    >> <http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/microsoft/7893609/Microsoft-co-founder-Paul-Allen-gives-away-half-of-his-fortune.html>
    >>
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Yeah, but the other half will last him and twenty of his descendants for
    > a long, long time. He gave it out of guilt, just like Gates and Buffet
    > did. When they give ALL of their fortune to charity and start living out
    > on the street, you'll have something. And Paul Allen won't let go of it
    > until after he dies which gives him plenty of time to change his mind.
    >


    Excuses, excuses, excuses. Why should rich people bother, anyway, with
    this attitude? Anyway, he has terminal cancer.

    All you've got to offer is nothing.
     
  17. Alias

    Alias Flightless Bird

    On 10/13/2010 05:52 PM, Boscoe wrote:
    > On 13/10/2010 4:45 PM, Alias wrote:
    >> On 10/13/2010 05:41 PM, Boscoe wrote:
    >>> On 13/10/2010 4:24 PM, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>> Whether IE is free or not has nothing to do with my original statement:
    >>>> "My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >>>> multibillion dollar corporation for free." The last I heard, MS is
    >>>> not a
    >>>> nonprofit corporation.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> So, haw much have you given to charity?
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> <http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/microsoft/7893609/Microsoft-co-founder-Paul-Allen-gives-away-half-of-his-fortune.html>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> Yeah, but the other half will last him and twenty of his descendants for
    >> a long, long time. He gave it out of guilt, just like Gates and Buffet
    >> did. When they give ALL of their fortune to charity and start living out
    >> on the street, you'll have something. And Paul Allen won't let go of it
    >> until after he dies which gives him plenty of time to change his mind.
    >>

    >
    > Excuses, excuses, excuses.


    Not one excuse there. I posted factoids, something you seem to be
    unfamiliar with.

    > Why should rich people bother, anyway, with
    > this attitude?


    My attitude is spot on and I don't need any money.

    > Anyway, he has terminal cancer.


    Goes to show money isn't everything, doesn't it?

    > All you've got to offer is nothing.


    You don't have a clue as to what I have or what I offer.

    --
    Alias
     
  18. Boscoe

    Boscoe Flightless Bird

    On 13/10/2010 4:57 PM, Alias wrote:
    > On 10/13/2010 05:52 PM, Boscoe wrote:
    >> On 13/10/2010 4:45 PM, Alias wrote:
    >>> On 10/13/2010 05:41 PM, Boscoe wrote:
    >>>> On 13/10/2010 4:24 PM, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Whether IE is free or not has nothing to do with my original
    >>>>> statement:
    >>>>> "My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >>>>> multibillion dollar corporation for free." The last I heard, MS is
    >>>>> not a
    >>>>> nonprofit corporation.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> So, haw much have you given to charity?
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> <http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/microsoft/7893609/Microsoft-co-founder-Paul-Allen-gives-away-half-of-his-fortune.html>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Yeah, but the other half will last him and twenty of his descendants for
    >>> a long, long time. He gave it out of guilt, just like Gates and Buffet
    >>> did. When they give ALL of their fortune to charity and start living out
    >>> on the street, you'll have something. And Paul Allen won't let go of it
    >>> until after he dies which gives him plenty of time to change his mind.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Excuses, excuses, excuses.

    >
    > Not one excuse there. I posted factoids, something you seem to be
    > unfamiliar with.
    >
    >> Why should rich people bother, anyway, with
    >> this attitude?

    >
    > My attitude is spot on and I don't need any money.
    >
    >> Anyway, he has terminal cancer.

    >
    > Goes to show money isn't everything, doesn't it?
    >
    >> All you've got to offer is nothing.

    >
    > You don't have a clue as to what I have or what I offer.
    >



    Unfortunately, I'm sure many on here know exactly what you've got to offer.
     
  19. Alias

    Alias Flightless Bird

    On 10/13/2010 06:00 PM, Boscoe wrote:

    >>
    >> You don't have a clue as to what I have or what I offer.
    >>

    >
    >
    > Unfortunately, I'm sure many on here know exactly what you've got to offer.


    No, you don't. No one here knows.

    --
    Alias
     
  20. Frank

    Frank Flightless Bird

    alias the loser

    On 10/13/2010 8:45 AM, Alias wrote:
    > On 10/13/2010 05:41 PM, Boscoe wrote:
    >> On 13/10/2010 4:24 PM, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Whether IE is free or not has nothing to do with my original statement:
    >>> "My take on beta software is that I don't want to work for a
    >>> multibillion dollar corporation for free." The last I heard, MS is not a
    >>> nonprofit corporation.

    >>
    >>
    >> So, haw much have you given to charity?
    >>
    >>
    >> <http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/microsoft/7893609/Microsoft-co-founder-Paul-Allen-gives-away-half-of-his-fortune.html>
    >>
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Yeah, but the other half will last him and twenty of his descendants for
    > a long, long time. He gave it out of guilt, just like Gates and Buffet
    > did.


    You know this because it is how & why you, who are void of character,
    would give?
    Figures.
    You need to stop pretending you know the mindset of others, because its
    obvious it's your mindset that you are trying to impose on them.
    Big fucking oops, you stupid bastard!

    When they give ALL of their fortune to charity and start living out
    > on the street, you'll have something. And Paul Allen won't let go of it
    > until after he dies which gives him plenty of time to change his mind.


    Have you done that?
    Oops! What a POS asshole loser you are.
    >
     

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