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Need USB card with enough power for external hard drive

Discussion in 'Notebooks' started by Carl, May 23, 2010.

  1. Carl

    Carl Flightless Bird

    I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    both of them into the Cardbus card.

    What card should I get? I see many different brands on E-Bay. I need
    one that supplies sufficient power for an external hard drive, and
    doesn't have any "known limitations" in the way.
     
  2. Roger Mills

    Roger Mills Flightless Bird

    On 23/05/2010 16:58, Carl wrote:
    > I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    > My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    > work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    > ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    > plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    > limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    > details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    > "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    > little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    > two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    > both of them into the Cardbus card.
    >
    > What card should I get? I see many different brands on E-Bay. I need
    > one that supplies sufficient power for an external hard drive, and
    > doesn't have any "known limitations" in the way.
    >


    The cardbus card probably *can't* supply enough power unless there's a
    way of getting power to it from another source. I have a 4 x USB2 port
    cardbus card made by Pluscom which has a little power socket on the
    front in addition to the USB ports. It comes with a lead which plugs
    into a normal USB port just for the purpose of supplying power to the card.

    Do you have any other source of power for USB devices, such as a
    USB-based mobile phone charger? If so, you could try plugging one of the
    drive's plugs into *that* - which may solve the problem.
    --
    Cheers,
    Roger
    ____________
    Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    checked.
     
  3. Paul

    Paul Flightless Bird

    Carl wrote:
    > I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    > My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    > work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    > ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    > plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    > limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    > details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    > "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    > little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    > two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    > both of them into the Cardbus card.
    >
    > What card should I get? I see many different brands on E-Bay. I need
    > one that supplies sufficient power for an external hard drive, and
    > doesn't have any "known limitations" in the way.
    >


    If you used an external 3.5" USB drive enclosure, they come
    with their own power adapter. That is another way to solve the
    problem.

    http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/22-152-230-Z05?$S640W$

    Paul
     
  4. Carl

    Carl Flightless Bird

    On May 23, 12:37 pm, Roger Mills <watt.ty...@gmail.com> wrote:
    > On 23/05/2010 16:58, Carl wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > > I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    > > My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    > > work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    > > ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    > > plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    > > limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    > > details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    > > "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    > > little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    > > two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    > > both of them into the Cardbus card.

    >
    > > What card should I get? I see many different brands on E-Bay. I need
    > > one that supplies sufficient power for an external hard drive, and
    > > doesn't have any "known limitations" in the way.

    >
    > The cardbus card probably *can't* supply enough power unless there's a
    > way of getting power to it from another source. I have a 4 x USB2 port
    > cardbus card made by Pluscom which has a little power socket on the
    > front in addition to the USB ports. It comes with a lead which plugs
    > into a normal USB port just for the purpose of supplying power to the card.
    >
    > Do you have any other source of power for USB devices, such as a
    > USB-based mobile phone charger? If so, you could try plugging one of the
    > drive's plugs into *that* - which may solve the problem.
    > --
    > Cheers,
    > Roger
    > ____________
    > Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    > checked.


    The card has a hole in between the two USB port for a plug, but the
    card didn't come with a cable. I checked E-bay. I could get a new
    card that comes with a cable for the same price as just a cable.
     
  5. Carl

    Carl Flightless Bird

    On May 23, 1:27 pm, Paul <nos...@needed.com> wrote:
    > Carl wrote:
    > > I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    > > My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    > > work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    > > ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    > > plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    > > limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    > > details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    > > "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    > > little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    > > two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    > > both of them into the Cardbus card.

    >
    > > What card should I get? I see many different brands on E-Bay. I need
    > > one that supplies sufficient power for an external hard drive, and
    > > doesn't have any "known limitations" in the way.

    >
    > If you used an external 3.5" USB drive enclosure, they come
    > with their own power adapter. That is another way to solve the
    > problem.
    >
    > http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/22-152-230-Z05?$S640W$
    >
    >     Paul


    It's a 2.5" USB drive enclosure. It doesn't have a plug for a power
    adapter.
     
  6. mike

    mike Flightless Bird

    Carl wrote:
    > On May 23, 12:37 pm, Roger Mills <watt.ty...@gmail.com> wrote:
    >> On 23/05/2010 16:58, Carl wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>> I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    >>> My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    >>> work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    >>> ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    >>> plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    >>> limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    >>> details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    >>> "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    >>> little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    >>> two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    >>> both of them into the Cardbus card.
    >>> What card should I get? I see many different brands on E-Bay. I need
    >>> one that supplies sufficient power for an external hard drive, and
    >>> doesn't have any "known limitations" in the way.

    >> The cardbus card probably *can't* supply enough power unless there's a
    >> way of getting power to it from another source. I have a 4 x USB2 port
    >> cardbus card made by Pluscom which has a little power socket on the
    >> front in addition to the USB ports. It comes with a lead which plugs
    >> into a normal USB port just for the purpose of supplying power to the card.
    >>
    >> Do you have any other source of power for USB devices, such as a
    >> USB-based mobile phone charger? If so, you could try plugging one of the
    >> drive's plugs into *that* - which may solve the problem.
    >> --
    >> Cheers,
    >> Roger
    >> ____________
    >> Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    >> checked.

    >
    > The card has a hole in between the two USB port for a plug, but the
    > card didn't come with a cable. I checked E-bay. I could get a new
    > card that comes with a cable for the same price as just a cable.


    A USB1 port is limited to about 100mA. A usb2 port is limited to about
    500mA. Actual computer implementations vary all over the map.
    Some just current limit and recover gracefully. I had one laptop that
    plain shut off the usb ports until I rebooted.

    An external hard drive can pull upwards of 1AMP depending on the model.

    Plugging an external hard drive into a laptop is a good way to FRY the
    ports.

    The reason they give you two usb connectors is so you can plug them in
    and get an amp total. But this can force one of the ports to current
    limit. That overstresses the current limit device and causes it to fail
    over time.

    Cardbus usb cards come in many variants. Some will run a hard drive
    even though they EXCEED the design limits of your laptp and can cause
    problems. Others just won't run the drive. I have one card that has
    ZERO 5V output until you run a cable from the hole in the card to
    a usb port or mouse port for power.

    External hard drive enclosures come in many variants. Many of the newer
    ones have no capability to add external power. Depending on the hard
    drive inside, you may or may not be able to run if from a laptop.
    They'll usually run from a desktop usb2 port. Or better yet, a powered hub.
    Older drive enclosures have a 5V power input so you can plug in a wall
    wart and they work fine. But they also have problems. The designers
    saved money by hooking the external 5V directly to the 5V usb line.
    Although it's bad, bad, bad practice, it works most of the time.
    Problem is when you turn off the laptop and the external drive
    tries to supply 5V back thru the usb port. This can cause significant
    destruction of the usb port, the hard drive as it thrashes trying to
    power up, etc.
    Another thing they do is use two diodes to isolate the two power
    supplies. That fixes the power problem, but now, you have less than
    5V and the hard drive may have trouble running.

    I've addressed the problem three ways.

    Use a powered hub. That works, but depending on your OS and the hub,
    there may be problems with some software or hardware.

    I took a usb extension cable, cut the power wire and spliced in 5V
    from a regulated wall wart to power the drive. I'm very careful to
    start the laptop before plugging in the drive and removing the drive
    before shutting down the laptop. If your drive enclosure has
    an external power input, you don't need the modified wire.

    I had a laptop that I used as a permanent mp3 player. I modified the
    docking station by rewiring power for one usb port thru a fuse to the
    keyboard/mouse power socket. Risky in general, but ok for a dedicated
    application.

    So, why do you need the external drive anyway. Internal hard drives
    are huge these days. USB flash drives are BIG. If you blew the ports,
    you can get a flash reader that plugs into the cardbus slot. You can
    transfer files via the network connection.

    The backup problem is solved by having a small 8-16GB C partitoin
    and backing it up to the D partition. Then move the files to archive
    storage via the network of flash memory.
     
  7. BillW50

    BillW50 Flightless Bird

    On 5/23/2010 2:05 PM, mike wrote on Sun, 23 May 2010 12:05:23 -0700:
    > Plugging an external hard drive into a laptop is a good way to FRY the
    > ports.


    According to the USB specs, that isn't supposed to happen. As the specs
    say it should be designed to stop supplying power if the device wants
    more than 500ma for USB2. And when the load is removed, it is supposed
    to automatically supply power once again.

    But we both know it doesn't work that way in real life. I have two USB2
    DVD drives from China that will shutdown my Asus EeePC netbooks if they
    are up and running. Oh they instantly reboot in a flash, but everything
    you were doing was lost. If you connect them up before turning on the
    netbooks, it isn't a problem. Even using only one USB for power.

    On my four Gateway laptops, this isn't a problem at all. Even these two
    devices you can suck lots of power if you want too. And they just don't
    care. Since they all have 4 USB2 ports, my guess that they allow all
    four or just one alone to suck up to 2 amps of power before they complain.

    USB ports are supposed to power down if the computer is off. Although
    this isn't true with my Asus netbooks either. As if it has AC power,
    they are always live. Only on battery power do they shutdown power on
    the USB ports.

    I am sure others might have other variations as well. And I would love
    to hear what they are. As there is supposed to be one standard. But we
    know better that not all follow it.

    --
    Bill
    Thunderbird Portable 3.0 (20091130)
     
  8. BillW50

    BillW50 Flightless Bird

    On 5/23/2010 2:05 PM, mike wrote on Sun, 23 May 2010 12:05:23 -0700:
    > The backup problem is solved by having a small 8-16GB C partitoin
    > and backing it up to the D partition. Then move the files to archive
    > storage via the network of flash memory.


    Are you sure that is necessary? As I really like having the whole drive
    partitioned as Drive C. The reason for this is because it makes sense to
    have all of the room you want without partitions splitting it up for you.

    And most backup programs you can select which files and folders you want
    to save anyway. So if you rather make separate backups of your data
    separate from the OS, it isn't really a problem.

    Heck I used to use BartPE to just copy files and folders to do a whole
    backup too. Worked great except for MS Works v8 which would be broken if
    you restored everything back. I don't know why this was as I never
    figured it out? My guess was copying from NTFS to FAT32 broke it. I
    didn't use MS Works much anyway and I have most of the versions of it.
    Mostly since it came with most of the computers I bought anyway.

    --
    Bill
    Thunderbird Portable 3.0 (20091130)
     
  9. Carl

    Carl Flightless Bird

    On May 23, 3:05 pm, mike <spam...@go.com> wrote:
    > Carl wrote:
    > > On May 23, 12:37 pm, Roger Mills <watt.ty...@gmail.com> wrote:
    > >> On 23/05/2010 16:58, Carl wrote:

    >
    > >>> I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    > >>> My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    > >>> work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    > >>> ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    > >>> plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    > >>> limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    > >>> details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    > >>> "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    > >>> little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    > >>> two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    > >>> both of them into the Cardbus card.
    > >>> What card should I get? I see many different brands on E-Bay. I need
    > >>> one that supplies sufficient power for an external hard drive, and
    > >>> doesn't have any "known limitations" in the way.
    > >> The cardbus card probably *can't* supply enough power unless there's a
    > >> way of getting power to it from another source. I have a 4 x USB2 port
    > >> cardbus card made by Pluscom which has a little power socket on the
    > >> front in addition to the USB ports. It comes with a lead which plugs
    > >> into a normal USB port just for the purpose of supplying power to the card.

    >
    > >> Do you have any other source of power for USB devices, such as a
    > >> USB-based mobile phone charger? If so, you could try plugging one of the
    > >> drive's plugs into *that* - which may solve the problem.
    > >> --
    > >> Cheers,
    > >> Roger
    > >> ____________
    > >> Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    > >> checked.

    >
    > > The card has a hole in between the two USB port for a plug, but the
    > > card didn't come with a cable.  I checked E-bay.  I could get a new
    > > card that comes with a cable for the same price as just a cable.

    >
    > A USB1 port is limited to about 100mA.  A usb2 port is limited to about
    > 500mA.  Actual computer implementations vary all over the map.
    > Some just current limit and recover gracefully.  I had one laptop that
    > plain shut off the usb ports until I rebooted.
    >
    > An external hard drive can pull upwards of 1AMP depending on the model.
    >
    > Plugging an external hard drive into a laptop is a good way to FRY the
    > ports.
    >
    > The reason they give you two usb connectors is so you can plug them in
    > and get an amp total.  But this can force one of the ports to current
    > limit.  That overstresses the current limit device and causes it to fail
    > over time.
    >
    > Cardbus usb cards come in many variants.  Some will run a hard drive
    > even though they EXCEED the design limits of your laptp and can cause
    > problems.  Others just won't run the drive.  I have one card that has
    > ZERO 5V output until you run a cable from the hole in the card to
    > a usb port or mouse port for power.
    >
    > External hard drive enclosures come in many variants. Many of the newer
    > ones have no capability to add external power.  Depending on the hard
    > drive inside, you may or may not be able to run if from a laptop.
    > They'll usually run from a desktop usb2 port.  Or better yet, a poweredhub.
    > Older drive enclosures have a 5V power input so you can plug in a wall
    > wart and they work fine.  But they also have problems.  The designers
    > saved money by hooking the external 5V directly to the 5V usb line.
    > Although it's bad, bad, bad practice, it works most of the time.
    > Problem is when you turn off the laptop and the external drive
    > tries to supply 5V back thru the usb port.  This can cause significant
    > destruction of the usb port, the hard drive as it thrashes trying to
    > power up, etc.
    > Another thing they do is use two diodes to isolate the two power
    > supplies.  That fixes the power problem, but now, you have less than
    > 5V and the hard drive may have trouble running.
    >
    > I've addressed the problem three ways.
    >
    > Use a powered hub.  That works, but depending on your OS and the hub,
    > there may be problems with some software or hardware.
    >
    > I took a usb extension cable, cut the power wire and spliced in 5V
    > from a regulated wall wart to power the drive.  I'm very careful to
    > start the laptop before plugging in the drive and removing the drive
    > before shutting down the laptop.  If your drive enclosure has
    > an external power input, you don't need the modified wire.
    >
    > I had a laptop that I used as a permanent mp3 player.  I modified the
    > docking station by rewiring power for one usb port thru a fuse to the
    > keyboard/mouse power socket.  Risky in general, but ok for a dedicated
    > application.
    >
    > So, why do you need the external drive anyway.  Internal hard drives
    > are huge these days.  USB flash drives are BIG.  If you blew the ports,
    > you can get a flash reader that plugs into the cardbus slot.  You can
    > transfer files via the network connection.
    >
    > The backup problem is solved by having a small 8-16GB C partitoin
    > and backing it up to the D partition.  Then move the files to archive
    > storage via the network of flash memory.


    The USB cable has two USB plugs on one end, and one of those is on a
    thinner cable (after the "Y"). Someone told me that other plug was
    for attaching another USB device (so you can attach two devices to one
    USB port on your computer), but I thought it was for more power, like
    you are saying. I might be interested in cutting that 2nd one off,
    and wiring it to a 5 volt/500MA wall plug (do you know a good
    source?). I'm not an electrician - I want to use the right wires and
    get the polarity right. Do you have any additional tips? Which wires
    in the USB cable to use? BTW - I ALWAYS plug in the external hard
    drive AFTER the computer is on, and I ALWAYS use "safely remove
    hardware" before unplugging it, and I NEVER turn the computer off with
    it plugged in.
     
  10. mike

    mike Flightless Bird

    Carl wrote:
    > On May 23, 3:05 pm, mike <spam...@go.com> wrote:
    >> Carl wrote:
    >>> On May 23, 12:37 pm, Roger Mills <watt.ty...@gmail.com> wrote:
    >>>> On 23/05/2010 16:58, Carl wrote:
    >>>>> I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    >>>>> My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    >>>>> work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    >>>>> ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    >>>>> plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    >>>>> limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    >>>>> details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    >>>>> "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    >>>>> little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    >>>>> two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    >>>>> both of them into the Cardbus card.
    >>>>> What card should I get? I see many different brands on E-Bay. I need
    >>>>> one that supplies sufficient power for an external hard drive, and
    >>>>> doesn't have any "known limitations" in the way.
    >>>> The cardbus card probably *can't* supply enough power unless there's a
    >>>> way of getting power to it from another source. I have a 4 x USB2 port
    >>>> cardbus card made by Pluscom which has a little power socket on the
    >>>> front in addition to the USB ports. It comes with a lead which plugs
    >>>> into a normal USB port just for the purpose of supplying power to the card.
    >>>> Do you have any other source of power for USB devices, such as a
    >>>> USB-based mobile phone charger? If so, you could try plugging one of the
    >>>> drive's plugs into *that* - which may solve the problem.
    >>>> --
    >>>> Cheers,
    >>>> Roger
    >>>> ____________
    >>>> Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    >>>> checked.
    >>> The card has a hole in between the two USB port for a plug, but the
    >>> card didn't come with a cable. I checked E-bay. I could get a new
    >>> card that comes with a cable for the same price as just a cable.

    >> A USB1 port is limited to about 100mA. A usb2 port is limited to about
    >> 500mA. Actual computer implementations vary all over the map.
    >> Some just current limit and recover gracefully. I had one laptop that
    >> plain shut off the usb ports until I rebooted.
    >>
    >> An external hard drive can pull upwards of 1AMP depending on the model.
    >>
    >> Plugging an external hard drive into a laptop is a good way to FRY the
    >> ports.
    >>
    >> The reason they give you two usb connectors is so you can plug them in
    >> and get an amp total. But this can force one of the ports to current
    >> limit. That overstresses the current limit device and causes it to fail
    >> over time.
    >>
    >> Cardbus usb cards come in many variants. Some will run a hard drive
    >> even though they EXCEED the design limits of your laptp and can cause
    >> problems. Others just won't run the drive. I have one card that has
    >> ZERO 5V output until you run a cable from the hole in the card to
    >> a usb port or mouse port for power.
    >>
    >> External hard drive enclosures come in many variants. Many of the newer
    >> ones have no capability to add external power. Depending on the hard
    >> drive inside, you may or may not be able to run if from a laptop.
    >> They'll usually run from a desktop usb2 port. Or better yet, a powered hub.
    >> Older drive enclosures have a 5V power input so you can plug in a wall
    >> wart and they work fine. But they also have problems. The designers
    >> saved money by hooking the external 5V directly to the 5V usb line.
    >> Although it's bad, bad, bad practice, it works most of the time.
    >> Problem is when you turn off the laptop and the external drive
    >> tries to supply 5V back thru the usb port. This can cause significant
    >> destruction of the usb port, the hard drive as it thrashes trying to
    >> power up, etc.
    >> Another thing they do is use two diodes to isolate the two power
    >> supplies. That fixes the power problem, but now, you have less than
    >> 5V and the hard drive may have trouble running.
    >>
    >> I've addressed the problem three ways.
    >>
    >> Use a powered hub. That works, but depending on your OS and the hub,
    >> there may be problems with some software or hardware.
    >>
    >> I took a usb extension cable, cut the power wire and spliced in 5V
    >> from a regulated wall wart to power the drive. I'm very careful to
    >> start the laptop before plugging in the drive and removing the drive
    >> before shutting down the laptop. If your drive enclosure has
    >> an external power input, you don't need the modified wire.
    >>
    >> I had a laptop that I used as a permanent mp3 player. I modified the
    >> docking station by rewiring power for one usb port thru a fuse to the
    >> keyboard/mouse power socket. Risky in general, but ok for a dedicated
    >> application.
    >>
    >> So, why do you need the external drive anyway. Internal hard drives
    >> are huge these days. USB flash drives are BIG. If you blew the ports,
    >> you can get a flash reader that plugs into the cardbus slot. You can
    >> transfer files via the network connection.
    >>
    >> The backup problem is solved by having a small 8-16GB C partitoin
    >> and backing it up to the D partition. Then move the files to archive
    >> storage via the network of flash memory.

    >
    > The USB cable has two USB plugs on one end, and one of those is on a
    > thinner cable (after the "Y"). Someone told me that other plug was
    > for attaching another USB device (so you can attach two devices to one
    > USB port on your computer), but I thought it was for more power, like
    > you are saying.


    You can tell if it's a plug or a socket. I've only seen ones with two
    plugs.

    I might be interested in cutting that 2nd one off,
    > and wiring it to a 5 volt/500MA wall plug (do you know a good
    > source?).

    You don't want a 500mA wall plug. You want at least an amp

    Don't cut the cable, get a wall wart with a usb socket in it
    designed to do exactly what you need. You can get on at any computer
    store. Or for cheap if you order it out of china. Check ebay.

    I'm not an electrician - I want to use the right wires and
    > get the polarity right. Do you have any additional tips?


    Just buy one, they're cheap.
    Which wires
    > in the USB cable to use? BTW - I ALWAYS plug in the external hard
    > drive AFTER the computer is on, and I ALWAYS use "safely remove
    > hardware" before unplugging it, and I NEVER turn the computer off with
    > it plugged in.

    That's what I said until about the third time I did it
    and the laptop internal hard drive started banging itself against the stops.
    Now, I just admit that I don't always do everything right.
     
  11. mike

    mike Flightless Bird

    BillW50 wrote:
    > On 5/23/2010 2:05 PM, mike wrote on Sun, 23 May 2010 12:05:23 -0700:
    >> The backup problem is solved by having a small 8-16GB C partitoin
    >> and backing it up to the D partition. Then move the files to archive
    >> storage via the network of flash memory.

    >
    > Are you sure that is necessary? As I really like having the whole drive
    > partitioned as Drive C. The reason for this is because it makes sense to
    > have all of the room you want without partitions splitting it up for you.


    You're welcome to use any method you like. I have a recommendation.

    I regularly get calls from friends...

    "I hozed my system and it won't boot."
    Ok, just restore the backup.
    I don't have a backup.
    Why?
    Because my drive is a single 500GB partition and I don't have any place
    to put the backup. And it would take three hours to do and I'm a busy
    person.
    Let me get this straight...you're too busy to back up your system,
    but you think I'm not too busy to try to recover your system????

    I have a 16GB windows7 partition and two more 100GB partitions.
    I put all media files, databases, maps, everything that is archived,
    easy to reinstall, or otherwise duplicated on D.
    I can use Acronis to image up C to E in about 10 minutes while I'm using
    the system, although I usually go have coffee while it's happening.
    Then I copy the image to the backup drive over the network.
    I typically have months of backups on hand. Try that with a full
    backup of a gigabyte drive. And I can copy the root partition to
    a 40GB drive and quickly have a system that I can experiment on without
    risking the primary system drive. Comes in really handy when trying
    out freeware that's really spyware.

    I can recover from a hozed system in about 10 minutes. Takes a little
    longer if E is hozed and I have to copy the image from the backup drive.
    No reinstalls, no license codes, no registry hacks, no reconfigurations.
    It's right back where it was.

    The time to plan your backup strategy is before you partition your
    hard drive. Image the root drive...make it as small as you can.
    Copy files from the other partitions to back them up.


    >
    > And most backup programs you can select which files and folders you want
    > to save anyway. So if you rather make separate backups of your data
    > separate from the OS, it isn't really a problem.
    >
    > Heck I used to use BartPE to just copy files and folders to do a whole
    > backup too. Worked great except for MS Works v8 which would be broken if
    > you restored everything back. I don't know why this was as I never
    > figured it out? My guess was copying from NTFS to FAT32 broke it. I
    > didn't use MS Works much anyway and I have most of the versions of it.
    > Mostly since it came with most of the computers I bought anyway.
    >
     
  12. Jan Alter

    Jan Alter Flightless Bird

    "Carl" <carl33@mailinator.com> wrote in message
    news:832c152d-98be-4425-8c3e-52bc183b51f5@40g2000vbr.googlegroups.com...
    On May 23, 1:27 pm, Paul <nos...@needed.com> wrote:
    > Carl wrote:
    > > I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    > > My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    > > work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    > > ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    > > plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    > > limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    > > details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    > > "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    > > little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    > > two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    > > both of them into the Cardbus card.

    >
    > > What card should I get? I see many different brands on E-Bay. I need
    > > one that supplies sufficient power for an external hard drive, and
    > > doesn't have any "known limitations" in the way.

    >
    > If you used an external 3.5" USB drive enclosure, they come
    > with their own power adapter. That is another way to solve the
    > problem.
    >
    > http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/22-152-230-Z05?$S640W$
    >
    > Paul


    >It's a 2.5" USB drive enclosure. It doesn't have a plug for a power
    >adapter.


    In that case move the hdd to an external drive case that has an additional
    power plug recepticle on it. Make sure you find out what the internal
    connector is for your 2.5" hdd (IDE or SATA)

    As an example. With these drives you would need to purchase an additional
    power to USB cable, but it should certainly work if you have two USB ports
    available and one to use for a mouse. This one has an internal SATA
    connection.

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817145329


    --
    Jan Alter
    bearpuf@verizon.net
     
  13. ~misfit~

    ~misfit~ Flightless Bird

    Somewhere on teh intarwebs mike wrote:
    > BillW50 wrote:
    >> On 5/23/2010 2:05 PM, mike wrote on Sun, 23 May 2010 12:05:23 -0700:
    >>> The backup problem is solved by having a small 8-16GB C partitoin
    >>> and backing it up to the D partition. Then move the files to archive
    >>> storage via the network of flash memory.

    >>
    >> Are you sure that is necessary? As I really like having the whole
    >> drive partitioned as Drive C. The reason for this is because it
    >> makes sense to have all of the room you want without partitions
    >> splitting it up for you.

    >
    > You're welcome to use any method you like. I have a recommendation.
    >
    > I regularly get calls from friends...
    >
    > "I hozed my system and it won't boot."
    > Ok, just restore the backup.
    > I don't have a backup.
    > Why?
    > Because my drive is a single 500GB partition and I don't have any
    > place to put the backup. And it would take three hours to do and I'm
    > a busy person.
    > Let me get this straight...you're too busy to back up your system,
    > but you think I'm not too busy to try to recover your system????
    >
    > I have a 16GB windows7 partition and two more 100GB partitions.
    > I put all media files, databases, maps, everything that is archived,
    > easy to reinstall, or otherwise duplicated on D.
    > I can use Acronis to image up C to E in about 10 minutes while I'm
    > using the system, although I usually go have coffee while it's
    > happening. Then I copy the image to the backup drive over the network.
    > I typically have months of backups on hand. Try that with a full
    > backup of a gigabyte drive. And I can copy the root partition to
    > a 40GB drive and quickly have a system that I can experiment on
    > without risking the primary system drive. Comes in really handy when
    > trying out freeware that's really spyware.
    >
    > I can recover from a hozed system in about 10 minutes. Takes a little
    > longer if E is hozed and I have to copy the image from the backup
    > drive. No reinstalls, no license codes, no registry hacks, no
    > reconfigurations. It's right back where it was.
    >
    > The time to plan your backup strategy is before you partition your
    > hard drive. Image the root drive...make it as small as you can.
    > Copy files from the other partitions to back them up.


    Agreed. I do the same thing. I also change the path for 'My Documents" to a
    folder on another partition so 'users' who save everything to My Documents
    don't get warnings about the HDD being full. An added advantage is that
    Windows can't scatter it's files all over half a TB of space, it's kept
    compact (and easy to defrag if that's your thing [it is mine]) so the drive
    heads aren't flapping about like albatross chicks come time to boot the
    machine.

    If someone who's machine I've set up comes back to me with a hosed install
    chances are I have an Acronis image of their virgin install on one of my
    external HDDs (and I would have given them a DVD with it on as well, at
    least for XP users). It's then the work of less than 30 minutes (more like
    15) to have it back as it was when if left my place originally.

    IMO using the whole HDD as a single C partition with drives the size they
    are these days is absurd from a security (of data and from malware)
    viewpoint. (No offence intended Bill.)
    --
    Shaun.

    "When we dream.... that's just our brains defragmenting" G Jackson.
     
  14. Don Phillipson

    Don Phillipson Flightless Bird

    "Carl" <carl33@mailinator.com> wrote in message
    news:df27edd5-4118-4fc8-9e0b-dd095d5a6c06@c13g2000vbr.googlegroups.com...

    > I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    > My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    > work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    > ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    > plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    > limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    > details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    > "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    > little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    > two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    > both of them into the Cardbus card.
    >
    > What card should I get?


    The alternative is to get an enclosure for the ext. hard
    drive. The Samba brands include a transformer to
    supply drive power separately from the USB port.

    --
    Don Phillipson
    Carlsbad Springs
    (Ottawa, Canada)
     
  15. Dan

    Dan Flightless Bird

    On May 24, 12:41 am, "Don Phillipson" <e...@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> wrote:
    > "Carl" <car...@mailinator.com> wrote in message
    >
    > news:df27edd5-4118-4fc8-9e0b-dd095d5a6c06@c13g2000vbr.googlegroups.com...
    >
    > > I have an HT-Link Cardbus/PCMCIA USB 2.0 2-port card (NEC / 32-bit).
    > > My external hard drive w/USB adapter won't work with it, and it will
    > > work plugged directly into a USB port on a different laptop. (My USB
    > > ports got fried.) I got the card off E-Bay. My MP3 player works
    > > plugged into that card. The drivers for the card say "Known
    > > limitations: High Speed Isochronus, USB Composite Devices." (No other
    > > details provided.) I don't know if the hard drive adapter is
    > > "isochronous" or "composite." I've read there are problems with too
    > > little power being supplied to the drive. The cable to the drive has
    > > two USB plugs on one end, and it doesn't make any difference if I plug
    > > both of them into the Cardbus card.

    >
    > > What card should I get?

    >
    > The alternative is to get an enclosure for the ext. hard
    > drive. The Samba brands include a transformer to
    > supply drive power separately from the USB port.
    >
    > --
    > Don Phillipson
    > Carlsbad Springs
    > (Ottawa, Canada)


    Some 2.5 inch ext drives cables are y-shaped, with one arm of the "y"
    much longer--this gets into the gadget. The shorter arm contains Vcc
    and GND only, no data. I've thought all along if you have device not
    being detected properly because of insufficient power you could double
    the shorter "y" arm and plug it into adjacent unused USB port to boost
    the Vcc to gadget.
     
  16. J G Miller

    J G Miller Flightless Bird

    On Sun, 23 May 2010 22:24:01 -0400, Jan Alter wrote:
    > In that case move the hdd to an external drive case that has an
    > additional power plug recepticle on it. Make sure you find out what the
    > internal connector is for your 2.5" hdd (IDE or SATA)


    Good advice, but if the PC has an eSATA connector, then even better,
    get an external case with an eSATA connection.

    USB 2 allows transfer speeds of up to 480 MBytes per second.

    eSATA allows transfer speeds of up to 3 GBytes per second.
     
  17. Carl

    Carl Flightless Bird

    > Don't cut the cable, get a wall  wart with a usb socket in it
    > designed to do exactly what you need.  You can get on at any computer
    > store.  Or for cheap if you order it out of china.  Check ebay.


    I've never seed a wall plug transformer that a usb connection on one
    end. I'm not saying they don't exist.

    E-Bay says "0 results found for WALL WART USB SOCKET"

    What exactly is it called?
     
  18. Carl

    Carl Flightless Bird

    > >It's a 2.5" USB drive enclosure. It doesn't have a plug for a power
    > >adapter.

    >
    > In that case move the hdd to an external drive case that has an additional
    > power plug recepticle on it. Make sure you find out what the internal
    > connector is for your 2.5" hdd (IDE or SATA)
    >
    > As an example. With these drives you would need to purchase an additional
    > power to USB cable, but it should certainly work if you have two USB ports
    > available and one to use for a mouse. This one has an internal SATA
    > connection.
    >
    > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817145329
    >
    > --
    > Jan Alter
    > bear...@verizon.net


    That page says "There's no external power necessary either, since the
    drive gets its power from your computer." I already have an external
    drive case - that's how I'm accessing my 2.5 " IDE drive via a USB
    port.

    I don't see any listing on E-Bay matching "wall wart USB socket" as
    someone else here suggested (0 listings), and I don't see anything
    relevant when searching for "power usb cable." What EXACTLY is it
    called - a transformer you plug in the wall, and it has a cable with a
    USB socket on the end of it. Thanks.
     
  19. Carl

    Carl Flightless Bird

    On May 24, 9:57 am, J G Miller <mil...@yoyo_ORG> wrote:
    > On Sun, 23 May 2010 22:24:01 -0400, Jan Alter wrote:
    > > In that case move the hdd to an external drive case that has an
    > > additional power plug recepticle on it. Make sure you find out what the
    > > internal connector is for your 2.5" hdd (IDE or SATA)

    >
    > Good advice, but if the PC has an eSATA connector, then even better,
    > get an external case with an eSATA connection.
    >
    > USB 2 allows transfer speeds of up to 480 MBytes per second.
    >
    > eSATA allows transfer speeds of up to 3 GBytes per second.


    The drive is a 2.5" IDE.
     
  20. Carl

    Carl Flightless Bird

    On May 24, 12:51 pm, Carl <car...@mailinator.com> wrote:
    > > Don't cut the cable, get a wall  wart with a usb socket in it
    > > designed to do exactly what you need.  You can get on at any computer
    > > store.  Or for cheap if you order it out of china.  Check ebay.

    >
    > I've never seed a wall plug transformer that a usb connection on one
    > end.  I'm not saying they don't exist.
    >
    > E-Bay says "0 results found for WALL WART USB SOCKET"
    >
    > What exactly is it called?


    "seed" should be "seen."
     

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