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IE8 will not load

Discussion in 'Internet Explorer' started by Doug.CVD, Apr 19, 2010.

  1. Doug.CVD

    Doug.CVD Flightless Bird

    My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but nothing
    loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet Options on
    the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and re-installing
    IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode. All
    with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses, trojans,
    etc...........I have deleted all temp files, what the heck am I missing. Is
    there somebody out there that can give me some options?
     
  2. PA Bear [MS MVP]

    PA Bear [MS MVP] Flightless Bird

    Doug.CVD wrote:
    > My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but nothing
    > loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet Options
    > on
    > the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and
    > re-installing
    > IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode.
    > All
    > with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses,
    > trojans, etc...........I have deleted all temp files, what the heck am I
    > missing. Is there somebody out there that can give me some options?


    You mean like stating your full Windows version (e.g., WinXP SP3; WinXP
    64-bit SP2; Vista SP1; Vista 64-bit SP2; Win7; Win7 64-bit) when posting in
    a forum or newsgroup?
     
  3. Rob

    Rob Flightless Bird

    PA Bear [MS MVP] <PABearMVP@gmail.com> wrote:
    > Doug.CVD wrote:
    >> My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but nothing
    >> loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet Options
    >> on
    >> the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and
    >> re-installing
    >> IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode.
    >> All
    >> with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses,
    >> trojans, etc...........I have deleted all temp files, what the heck am I
    >> missing. Is there somebody out there that can give me some options?

    >
    > You mean like stating your full Windows version (e.g., WinXP SP3; WinXP
    > 64-bit SP2; Vista SP1; Vista 64-bit SP2; Win7; Win7 64-bit) when posting in
    > a forum or newsgroup?


    As if you suddenly could give him the answer if you knew that info in
    addition to what he already wrote...
     
  4. Doug.CVD

    Doug.CVD Flightless Bird

    I apologize . . . I am running Windows XP Professional SP3 - 32 bit on a
    Toshiba Satellite, with a Intel Celeron M processor (1.7GHz) and 1.12 GB of
    RAM.

    "Rob" wrote:

    > PA Bear [MS MVP] <PABearMVP@gmail.com> wrote:
    > > Doug.CVD wrote:
    > >> My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but nothing
    > >> loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet Options
    > >> on
    > >> the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and
    > >> re-installing
    > >> IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode.
    > >> All
    > >> with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses,
    > >> trojans, etc...........I have deleted all temp files, what the heck am I
    > >> missing. Is there somebody out there that can give me some options?

    > >
    > > You mean like stating your full Windows version (e.g., WinXP SP3; WinXP
    > > 64-bit SP2; Vista SP1; Vista 64-bit SP2; Win7; Win7 64-bit) when posting in
    > > a forum or newsgroup?

    >
    > As if you suddenly could give him the answer if you knew that info in
    > addition to what he already wrote...
    > .
    >
     
  5. Robert Aldwinckle

    Robert Aldwinckle Flightless Bird

    "Doug.CVD" <Doug.CVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
    news:84D78544-1FC3-4895-A15D-319242A47BBE@microsoft.com...
    > My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but nothing
    > loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet Options
    > on
    > the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and
    > re-installing
    > IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode.
    > All
    > with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses,
    > trojans,
    > etc...........I have deleted all temp files,


    > what the heck am I missing. Is
    > there somebody out there that can give me some options?



    "Click on the icon" means? E.g. use right-click Properties to see.

    "I get a flash" means? E.g. if you have a Taskbar icon too what does it
    look like and what are its properties? Or have Task Manager's Processes
    tab open while you're doing this to see if in fact an instance of
    iexplore.exe is being loaded and then quickly closing. Even better would
    be running ProcMon which would record exactly what is happening for the
    event.

    "start it via a command line in 'No Add-on' mode" means? E.g. if you used
    Run...

    iexplore.exe -nohome -extoff

    what did you see then? (Something more specific and factual than "no joy"
    please.) Note that if you use the -nohome switch you have to click on
    the Stop button to proceed but I would expect that you would at least have a
    Taskbar icon to examine before that.

    Remember, your words have to substitute for what our eyes might notice.

    BTW thank you for finally disclosing your OS and version. That may be
    helpful in suggesting other diagnostic procedures available to you.


    HTH

    Robert Aldwinckle
    ---
     
  6. Doug.CVD

    Doug.CVD Flightless Bird

    When I say "Click on the icon" I mean "Left Click" on the Blue E with a Gold
    Halo icon on my "Quick Launch Toolbar". When I do so, IE8 opens then closes
    so fast that all I see is a "White Flash" on my screen.

    A "Right Click" of the IE8 icon gives me a Target of: "C:/Program
    Files\Internet Explorer\iexplore.exe" and a Start in: %HOMEDRIVE%%HOMEPATH%

    When I use the "iexplore.exe -nohome -extoff" command in the Run dialog box,
    I get then IE8 opening for about a second then closing.

    Under Processes in the "Windows Task Manager" the "iexplorer.exe" process
    comes up and shows memory usage but no CPU usage. Under the Applications
    tab, IE only shows for a split second then goes away.

    I am not familiar with how to use the Process Monitor (ProcMon)...please
    advise.


    "Robert Aldwinckle" wrote:

    >
    >
    > "Doug.CVD" <Doug.CVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
    > news:84D78544-1FC3-4895-A15D-319242A47BBE@microsoft.com...
    > > My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but nothing
    > > loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet Options
    > > on
    > > the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and
    > > re-installing
    > > IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode.
    > > All
    > > with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses,
    > > trojans,
    > > etc...........I have deleted all temp files,

    >
    > > what the heck am I missing. Is
    > > there somebody out there that can give me some options?

    >
    >
    > "Click on the icon" means? E.g. use right-click Properties to see.
    >
    > "I get a flash" means? E.g. if you have a Taskbar icon too what does it
    > look like and what are its properties? Or have Task Manager's Processes
    > tab open while you're doing this to see if in fact an instance of
    > iexplore.exe is being loaded and then quickly closing. Even better would
    > be running ProcMon which would record exactly what is happening for the
    > event.
    >
    > "start it via a command line in 'No Add-on' mode" means? E.g. if you used
    > Run...
    >
    > iexplore.exe -nohome -extoff
    >
    > what did you see then? (Something more specific and factual than "no joy"
    > please.) Note that if you use the -nohome switch you have to click on
    > the Stop button to proceed but I would expect that you would at least have a
    > Taskbar icon to examine before that.
    >
    > Remember, your words have to substitute for what our eyes might notice.
    >
    > BTW thank you for finally disclosing your OS and version. That may be
    > helpful in suggesting other diagnostic procedures available to you.
    >
    >
    > HTH
    >
    > Robert Aldwinckle
    > ---
    >
    > .
    >
     
  7. PA Bear [MS MVP]

    PA Bear [MS MVP] Flightless Bird

    Is "Security Update for Windows Internet Explorer 8 (KB980182)" listed in
    Add/Remove Programs? (Make sure the Show Updates box at the top is checked)

    What anti-virus application or security suite is installed and is your
    subscription current? What anti-spyware applications (other than Defender)?
    What third-party firewall (if any)? Were any of these applications running
    in the background when you installed, uninstalled, and/or reinstalled IE8?

    Did the behavior persist after you'd uninstalled IE8 (but did not reinstall
    it)?

    Has a(nother) Norton or McAfee application ever been installed on this
    machine (e.g., a free-trial version that came preinstalled when you bought
    it)?


    Doug.CVD wrote:
    > I apologize . . . I am running Windows XP Professional SP3 - 32 bit on a
    > Toshiba Satellite, with a Intel Celeron M processor (1.7GHz) and 1.12 GB
    > of
    > RAM.
    >
    >>>> My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but
    >>>> nothing loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the
    >>>> Internet Options on
    >>>> the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and
    >>>> re-installing
    >>>> IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode.
    >>>> All
    >>>> with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses,
    >>>> trojans, etc...........I have deleted all temp files, what the heck am
    >>>> I
    >>>> missing. Is there somebody out there that can give me some options?
     
  8. Michael T

    Michael T Flightless Bird

    "Doug.CVD" <DougCVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
    >
    > When I say "Click on the icon" I mean "Left Click" on the Blue E with a
    > Gold
    > Halo icon on my "Quick Launch Toolbar". When I do so, IE8 opens then
    > closes
    > so fast that all I see is a "White Flash" on my screen.
    >


    You might want to share with us any errors you find with Event Viewer.

    Control Panel > Administrative Tools > Event Viewer

    Note: I would attempt to launch IE8 immediately before using Event Viewer,
    so that any errors you find would more likely have a date stamp correlating
    to the fact you just attempted to run IE8.

    I am particularly interested in "System" events (left pane) and Errors
    (white 'x' in a red circle) in the right pane. If you do not find any event
    errors, then also click Application in the left pane and check again for
    event errors in the right pane.

    Perhaps we can better assist you when armed with this information. Or, you
    can do Google searches for any errors you find.
     
  9. Doug.CVD

    Doug.CVD Flightless Bird

    The Event Viewer shows no Browser related errors under the tabs: Application,
    Security, System, or Windows Power Shell. Under "Internet Explorer" tab
    shows no logs whatsoever.

    "Michael T" wrote:

    > "Doug.CVD" <DougCVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
    > >
    > > When I say "Click on the icon" I mean "Left Click" on the Blue E with a
    > > Gold
    > > Halo icon on my "Quick Launch Toolbar". When I do so, IE8 opens then
    > > closes
    > > so fast that all I see is a "White Flash" on my screen.
    > >

    >
    > You might want to share with us any errors you find with Event Viewer.
    >
    > Control Panel > Administrative Tools > Event Viewer
    >
    > Note: I would attempt to launch IE8 immediately before using Event Viewer,
    > so that any errors you find would more likely have a date stamp correlating
    > to the fact you just attempted to run IE8.
    >
    > I am particularly interested in "System" events (left pane) and Errors
    > (white 'x' in a red circle) in the right pane. If you do not find any event
    > errors, then also click Application in the left pane and check again for
    > event errors in the right pane.
    >
    > Perhaps we can better assist you when armed with this information. Or, you
    > can do Google searches for any errors you find.
    >
    >
    > .
    >
     
  10. Michael T

    Michael T Flightless Bird

    "Doug.CVD" <DougCVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
    news:FA75FEDC-250E-493C-9A76-14AB0AAD65E9@microsoft.com...
    >
    > The Event Viewer shows no Browser related errors under the tabs:
    > Application,
    > Security, System, or Windows Power Shell. Under "Internet Explorer" tab
    > shows no logs whatsoever.
    >
    > "Michael T" wrote:
    >


    I'm a little surprised. Oh well.

    I wonder if IE8 will run by starting XP in Safe Mode by tapping the F8 key
    while you perform a reboot. Of course you will want to select "Safe Mode
    with Networking".
    http://www.pchell.com/support/safemode.shtml

    You could also try creating another user account at Control Panel > User
    Accounts.

    Then try to launch IE8, both with the desktop (or Quick Launch) icon and
    also with start > run iexplore about:blank

    If any of these work we may be able to isolate this further.
     
  11. Michael T

    Michael T Flightless Bird

    "Doug.CVD" <DougCVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
    >
    > The Event Viewer shows no Browser related errors under the tabs:
    > Application,
    > Security, System, or Windows Power Shell. Under "Internet Explorer" tab
    > shows no logs whatsoever.
    >


    There is a good discussion by others with a similar experience to yours and
    what they did to solve it at the link below. For example, if you have System
    Mechanic installed beware of possible problems with the Windows Registry.

    http://tinyurl.com/y795dsx
     
  12. Pooka

    Pooka Flightless Bird

    Doug,

    Believe it or not, this is normal.

    Open Task Manager
    Sort the Processes Tab by name
    Look for and select iexplore.exe and then click end process.

    Do this for all instances of iexplore.exe that are running.

    Your IE will now work

    Look for

    "Doug.CVD" wrote:

    > My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but nothing
    > loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet Options on
    > the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and re-installing
    > IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode. All
    > with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses, trojans,
    > etc...........I have deleted all temp files, what the heck am I missing. Is
    > there somebody out there that can give me some options?
     
  13. Doug.CVD

    Doug.CVD Flightless Bird

    When I boot up in Safe Mode IE8 comes up "Normally".

    I then booted back up normally and created a "Test" user profile ........
    with the new profile I get the same negative results.

    My brain hurts

    "Michael T" wrote:

    > "Doug.CVD" <DougCVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
    > news:FA75FEDC-250E-493C-9A76-14AB0AAD65E9@microsoft.com...
    > >
    > > The Event Viewer shows no Browser related errors under the tabs:
    > > Application,
    > > Security, System, or Windows Power Shell. Under "Internet Explorer" tab
    > > shows no logs whatsoever.
    > >
    > > "Michael T" wrote:
    > >

    >
    > I'm a little surprised. Oh well.
    >
    > I wonder if IE8 will run by starting XP in Safe Mode by tapping the F8 key
    > while you perform a reboot. Of course you will want to select "Safe Mode
    > with Networking".
    > http://www.pchell.com/support/safemode.shtml
    >
    > You could also try creating another user account at Control Panel > User
    > Accounts.
    >
    > Then try to launch IE8, both with the desktop (or Quick Launch) icon and
    > also with start > run iexplore about:blank
    >
    > If any of these work we may be able to isolate this further.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > .
    >
     
  14. Michael T

    Michael T Flightless Bird

    "Doug.CVD" <DougCVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
    >
    > When I boot up in Safe Mode IE8 comes up "Normally".
    >
    > I then booted back up normally and created a "Test" user profile ........
    > with the new profile I get the same negative results.
    >
    > My brain hurts
    >


    I think we have a new focus - I get a lot of search hits on "IE8 only runs
    in safe mode".

    Do you have Google Desktop (not to be confused with Google Toolbar)
    installed? Apparently there are some reports of a conflict with IE8.

    I know you have reinstalled IE8, so this may be a long shot. But I would try
    the following:

    Control Panel > Internet Options
    Go to the Advanced tab for IE8 and click the RESET button. Try again to run
    IE8.

    Since IE8 runs in Safe Mode, perhaps we should shutdown some of the services
    in MSCONFIG and attempt to isolate a service that is preventing IE8 from
    running in Normal Mode.

    Go to Start > Run
    Type msconfig in the Open box
    Click OK
    Select the Services tab
    Click the checkbox for "Hide All Microsoft Services"
    Click Disable All (ignore any error messages)
    Click OK

    Reboot continuing to ignore any error messages during reboot.

    Try again to run IE8 (ignore any connection issues, because our main focus
    is to get it to launch and continue running).

    If IE8 still won't run, reverse the process in MSCONFIG and click Enable
    All.

    If IE8 DOES launch, we may be onto something.

    Reenable the disabled services 1, 2 or 3 at a time (your choice) until you
    have isolated a service that is preventing IE8 from running in Normal mode
    as opposed to Safe Mode.
     
  15. Michael T

    Michael T Flightless Bird

    "Doug.CVD" <DougCVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
    >
    > Under Processes in the "Windows Task Manager" the "iexplorer.exe" process
    > comes up and shows memory usage but no CPU usage. Under the Applications
    > tab, IE only shows for a split second then goes away.
    >


    What happens if you click the End Process button for iexplorer.exe?
     
  16. Doug.CVD

    Doug.CVD Flightless Bird

    (SOLVED) RE: IE8 will not load

    I FOUND IT !!!! An obscure firewall setting that was not allowing it to give
    me the opportunity to approve the upgrade to IE8. I shut down all fire wall
    services then opened IE8. Once initiated, I re-enabled the firewall and it
    allowed me to approve the change. Using COMODO Internet Security Suite.

    Thank all of you guys for your assistance.

    "Pooka" wrote:

    > Doug,
    >
    > Believe it or not, this is normal.
    >
    > Open Task Manager
    > Sort the Processes Tab by name
    > Look for and select iexplore.exe and then click end process.
    >
    > Do this for all instances of iexplore.exe that are running.
    >
    > Your IE will now work
    >
    > Look for
    >
    > "Doug.CVD" wrote:
    >
    > > My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but nothing
    > > loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet Options on
    > > the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and re-installing
    > > IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode. All
    > > with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses, trojans,
    > > etc...........I have deleted all temp files, what the heck am I missing. Is
    > > there somebody out there that can give me some options?
     
  17. Michael T

    Michael T Flightless Bird

    "PA Bear [MS MVP]" <PABearMVP@gmail.com> wrote:
    >
    > What third-party firewall (if any)? Were any of these applications
    > running in the background when you installed, uninstalled, and/or
    > reinstalled IE8?
    >


    Great question!!!

    As you've probably noticed, Doug found a setting in a 3rd-party firewall
    named COMODO.

    In summary, this prevented him from running IE8 in Normal Mode - even though
    it would run in Safe Mode. Kudos to Doug for returning to post his solution.
     
  18. Michael T

    Michael T Flightless Bird

    Re: (SOLVED) RE: IE8 will not load

    "Doug.CVD" <DougCVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
    >
    >I FOUND IT !!!! An obscure firewall setting that was not allowing it to
    >give
    > me the opportunity to approve the upgrade to IE8. I shut down all fire
    > wall
    > services then opened IE8. Once initiated, I re-enabled the firewall and
    > it
    > allowed me to approve the change. Using COMODO Internet Security Suite.
    >
    > Thank all of you guys for your assistance.
    >


    I'm kicking myself for not thinking to ask about your firewall. As it turns
    out there were reports of problems installing IE8 on computers running
    COMODO as far back as January.
    http://tinyurl.com/y7klu5b

    So glad your persistence paid off and you solved it.
     
  19. Doug.CVD

    Doug.CVD Flightless Bird

    (SOLVED) RE: IE8 will not load

    I discovered an obscure firewall (COMODO) setting that was not allowing me to
    "approve" the IE8 update. I disabled the firewall, installed the update then
    re-enabled the firewall. The firewall then prompted me to approve the update.

    Thank you guys for assisting me to see what I was missing.

    "Pooka" wrote:

    > Doug,
    >
    > Believe it or not, this is normal.
    >
    > Open Task Manager
    > Sort the Processes Tab by name
    > Look for and select iexplore.exe and then click end process.
    >
    > Do this for all instances of iexplore.exe that are running.
    >
    > Your IE will now work
    >
    > Look for
    >
    > "Doug.CVD" wrote:
    >
    > > My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but nothing
    > > loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet Options on
    > > the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and re-installing
    > > IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode. All
    > > with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses, trojans,
    > > etc...........I have deleted all temp files, what the heck am I missing. Is
    > > there somebody out there that can give me some options?
     
  20. Robert Aldwinckle

    Robert Aldwinckle Flightless Bird

    "Doug.CVD" <DougCVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
    news:30F7761E-D504-4841-9805-CA1CF572BD17@microsoft.com...
    > When I say "Click on the icon" I mean "Left Click" on the Blue E with a
    > Gold
    > Halo icon on my "Quick Launch Toolbar". When I do so, IE8 opens then
    > closes
    > so fast that all I see is a "White Flash" on my screen.
    >
    > A "Right Click" of the IE8 icon gives me a Target of: "C:/Program
    > Files\Internet Explorer\iexplore.exe" and a Start in:
    > %HOMEDRIVE%%HOMEPATH%
    >
    > When I use the "iexplore.exe -nohome -extoff" command in the Run dialog
    > box,
    > I get then IE8 opening for about a second then closing.
    >
    > Under Processes in the "Windows Task Manager" the "iexplorer.exe" process
    > comes up and shows memory usage but no CPU usage. Under the Applications
    > tab, IE only shows for a split second then goes away.



    I've never seen that before. So, are you saying there was an iexplore.exe
    task was already running and each new attempt to start one was somehow
    getting terminated? I've never seen that before either. E.g. usually
    even if an iexplore.exe task is already running starting a new one with new
    command line options is enough for it to become a new task. Without the
    different command line options there is a risk that all that will be started
    is a new tab instance under an already hung main task.


    >
    > I am not familiar with how to use the Process Monitor (ProcMon)...please
    > advise.



    Basically you just start it up and let it run while you run your test.
    When you are interested in only one task as you are here you can use the
    filters to restrict your display to just that Image name.

    Glad to see you found a resolution to the symptom. ; )


    Robert
    ---



    >
    >
    > "Robert Aldwinckle" wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>
    >> "Doug.CVD" <Doug.CVD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
    >> news:84D78544-1FC3-4895-A15D-319242A47BBE@microsoft.com...
    >> > My IE8 will not load. When I click on the icon, I get a flash but
    >> > nothing
    >> > loads. I have tried resetting the IE8 properties in the Internet
    >> > Options
    >> > on
    >> > the Control Panel. I have tried un-installing downloading and
    >> > re-installing
    >> > IE8. I have tried to start it via a command line in "No Add-on" mode.
    >> > All
    >> > with no joy. I have scanned for Malware, adware, crapware, viruses,
    >> > trojans,
    >> > etc...........I have deleted all temp files,

    >>
    >> > what the heck am I missing. Is
    >> > there somebody out there that can give me some options?

    >>
    >>
    >> "Click on the icon" means? E.g. use right-click Properties to see.
    >>
    >> "I get a flash" means? E.g. if you have a Taskbar icon too what does
    >> it
    >> look like and what are its properties? Or have Task Manager's
    >> Processes
    >> tab open while you're doing this to see if in fact an instance of
    >> iexplore.exe is being loaded and then quickly closing. Even better
    >> would
    >> be running ProcMon which would record exactly what is happening for the
    >> event.
    >>
    >> "start it via a command line in 'No Add-on' mode" means? E.g. if you
    >> used
    >> Run...
    >>
    >> iexplore.exe -nohome -extoff
    >>
    >> what did you see then? (Something more specific and factual than "no
    >> joy"
    >> please.) Note that if you use the -nohome switch you have to click on
    >> the Stop button to proceed but I would expect that you would at least
    >> have a
    >> Taskbar icon to examine before that.
    >>
    >> Remember, your words have to substitute for what our eyes might notice.
    >>
    >> BTW thank you for finally disclosing your OS and version. That may be
    >> helpful in suggesting other diagnostic procedures available to you.
    >>
    >>
    >> HTH
    >>
    >> Robert Aldwinckle
    >> ---
    >>
    >> .
    >>
     

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