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How to group clips and drawing elements?

Discussion in 'Microsoft OneNote' started by Michael Moser, Mar 12, 2010.

  1. Michael Moser

    Michael Moser Flightless Bird

    I wanted to document all steps to install a larger program package using
    OneNote by taking "clips" (i.e. partial screenshots) and adding red circles
    around stuff that I had selected or entered.

    This worked at first quite nice. However, the clips and the drawing elements
    (ovals) seem to be on different "layers" (or whatever). When I later insert
    something on that page above, all the screenshots get pushed down (which is
    what I want and expect) but the red ovals stay where they were and hence now
    highlight wrong positions and my note thus becomes complete garbage.

    How can I "merge" or group the images/clips with the drawing elements so
    that they stick together?

    Michael
     
  2. Bernd

    Bernd Flightless Bird

    -------- Original-Nachricht --------

    > I wanted to document all steps to install a larger program package using
    > OneNote by taking "clips" (i.e. partial screenshots) and adding red
    > circles around stuff that I had selected or entered.
    >
    > This worked at first quite nice. However, the clips and the drawing
    > elements (ovals) seem to be on different "layers" (or whatever). When I
    > later insert something on that page above, all the screenshots get
    > pushed down (which is what I want and expect) but the red ovals stay
    > where they were and hence now highlight wrong positions and my note thus
    > becomes complete garbage.
    >
    > How can I "merge" or group the images/clips with the drawing elements so
    > that they stick together?
    >
    > Michael
    >
    >


    1. It's one of the real annoyances in ON that you cannot group items on
    a page.
    2. But you can avoid your problem by using the "(Insert or Remove Extra
    Writing Space" button from the Drawing Toolbar.

    Bernd
     
  3. mikeatdsc

    mikeatdsc Flightless Bird

    Michael,

    I have the EXACT same issue because I do that very same thing all the time. I document user interface bugs and data validity problems in that same manner. However it is irritating if I have to go back and modify something higher up in the document because all of the graphical elements get messed up. I personally think it is a bug but I am very interested to see if anyone knows of a work-around for this problem. Maybe it will be fixed in the 2010 version??

    Mike


    ---
    frmsrcurl: http://msgroups.net/microsoft.public.onenote/How-to-group-clips-and-drawing-elements
     
  4. mikeatdsc

    mikeatdsc Flightless Bird

  5. Bernd

    Bernd Flightless Bird


    >>

    >
    > 1. It's one of the real annoyances in ON that you cannot group items on
    > a page.
    > 2. But you can avoid your problem by using the "(Insert or Remove Extra
    > Writing Space" button from the Drawing Toolbar.
    >
    > Bernd


    P.S.:

    1. As an alternative you can use Insert -> Extra Writing Space
    2. Still no grouping in ON 2010

    Bernd
     
  6. Rainald Taesler

    Rainald Taesler Flightless Bird

    mikeatdsc wrote:
    > I have the EXACT same issue because I do that very same thing all the
    > time. I document user interface bugs and data validity problems in
    > that same manner. However it is irritating if I have to go back and
    > modify something higher up in the document because all of the
    > graphical elements get messed up. I personally think it is a bug but
    > I am very interested to see if anyone knows of a work-around for this
    > problem. Maybe it will be fixed in the 2010 version??


    No, it's not a bug.
    Just a *missing*feature* which would urgently ne needed.

    ON would need anchoring/grouping of objects. This has been requested and
    discussed in the early Beta of ON2007 already.
    Although it's the most seriously missing feature it has not taken up by
    the developers (who set other priorities) and so unfortunately nothing
    has changed in so far in ON2010. We have to wait for at least Office15
    {siiigh}.

    As much as love ON and as much as I use it (the # 1 of all apps in my
    systems, I have given up the idea of commenting inside ON (be it images
    or PDFs).
    For images I use SnagIt[1] which has everything needed for taking
    screenshots and editing/manipulating images and collect the results in
    ON.
    For PDFs I use the PDFAnnotator[2] and keep the commented files outside
    ON with links in the respective notebooks.

    Really sad that I have no better news nor suggestions.

    Rainald
    [1] http://www.techsmith.com/screen-capture.asp
    [2] http://ograhl.com/en/pdfannotator/
     
  7. JohnforAmerica

    JohnforAmerica Flightless Bird

    I'll admit this isn't the most sophisticated solution, but it has worked for
    me:

    I had a project where I wanted to have 8-10 "thought bubbles" that I wanted
    to physically manipulate. So naturally I crew the circles/ovals, then typed
    in/on them. If the text overran the circle, I either increased the size of
    the circle or decreased the text size. However, once these were done, you
    can imagine how bad it would SUCK to try to capture ONLY the items you wanted
    with the lasso and manipulate them. So instead, after I created each item, I
    took a snapshot with <win>+<s>, pasted the new one next to the old item, then
    erased the original "bubble" made up of two items.

    Essentially, I often find myself assembling things how I like them using
    multiple containers and "levels", then just taking a snapshot of the
    assembled beauty (monstrosity) and using it instead.

    Obviously this doesn't work if you need the text in the shape to be
    editable, but at that point, you could always just put a new container over
    the old text. I just think this method is particularly helpful when the
    primary goal is assembling and manipulating objects for the sake of
    organization. You can always do a final edit before you print, publish, or
    send!

    Hope that's helpful!

    John

    "Michael Moser" wrote:

    > I wanted to document all steps to install a larger program package using
    > OneNote by taking "clips" (i.e. partial screenshots) and adding red circles
    > around stuff that I had selected or entered.
    >
    > This worked at first quite nice. However, the clips and the drawing elements
    > (ovals) seem to be on different "layers" (or whatever). When I later insert
    > something on that page above, all the screenshots get pushed down (which is
    > what I want and expect) but the red ovals stay where they were and hence now
    > highlight wrong positions and my note thus becomes complete garbage.
    >
    > How can I "merge" or group the images/clips with the drawing elements so
    > that they stick together?
    >
    > Michael
    >
    >
     
  8. Michael Moser

    Michael Moser Flightless Bird

    "Rainald Taesler" <taesler@gmx.de> wrote in message
    news:%23FHAjqgwKHA.5812@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
    > > ...

    > ON would need anchoring/grouping of objects. This has been requested and
    > discussed in the early Beta of ON2007 already.
    > Although it's the most seriously missing feature it has not taken up by
    > the developers (who set other priorities) and so unfortunately nothing
    > has changed in so far in ON2010. We have to wait for at least Office15
    > {siiigh}.


    So, apparently the same story as with other badly missing features, that
    have been requested over and over again...

    I wonder why MS takes the effort to announce beta versions of Office
    products trying to encourage people to use and comment on it, if they then
    don't listen anyway. Based on such experience I didn't even bother to have a
    look at the recent ON 2010 beta, since I would bet on the fact that it won't
    have those most asked-for features and all requests to add those will be
    spoken into the wind anyway... But it will have stronger license
    enforcement, that's for sure!

    Michael (seeking a replacement for ON - suggestions?)
     
  9. Ben M. Schorr, MVP

    Ben M. Schorr, MVP Flightless Bird

    Well, I'm sorry you feel that way but the fact is that the OneNote team has
    consistently implemented asked-for features. The first one that jumps to
    mind is the internal hyperlinking. I'm sorry if your favorite requests
    haven't materialized yet but in the words of Steven Sinofsky:

    "Designing Microsoft Office is like ordering pizza for 400 million people."

    Can't accommodate every request. Mine don't always make the final cut
    either.

    --
    -Ben-
    Ben M. Schorr, MVP
    Roland Schorr & Tower
    http://www.rolandschorr.com
    http://www.officeforlawyers.com/outlook.html
    Author: The Lawyer's Guide to Microsoft Outlook 2007:
    http://tinyurl.com/ol4law-amazon

    "Michael Moser" <michael.nospam.moser@nospam.freesurf.ch> wrote in message
    news:epzwjYbxKHA.3564@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
    >
    > "Rainald Taesler" <taesler@gmx.de> wrote in message
    > news:%23FHAjqgwKHA.5812@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
    >> > ...

    >> ON would need anchoring/grouping of objects. This has been requested and
    >> discussed in the early Beta of ON2007 already.
    >> Although it's the most seriously missing feature it has not taken up by
    >> the developers (who set other priorities) and so unfortunately nothing
    >> has changed in so far in ON2010. We have to wait for at least Office15
    >> {siiigh}.

    >
    > So, apparently the same story as with other badly missing features, that
    > have been requested over and over again...
    >
    > I wonder why MS takes the effort to announce beta versions of Office
    > products trying to encourage people to use and comment on it, if they then
    > don't listen anyway. Based on such experience I didn't even bother to have
    > a look at the recent ON 2010 beta, since I would bet on the fact that it
    > won't have those most asked-for features and all requests to add those
    > will be spoken into the wind anyway... But it will have stronger license
    > enforcement, that's for sure!
    >
    > Michael (seeking a replacement for ON - suggestions?)
    >
     
  10. Dave

    Dave Flightless Bird

    On Mar 17, 8:26 pm, "Ben M. Schorr, MVP" <b...@bogusaddress.mvp>
    wrote:
    > Well, I'm sorry you feel that way but the fact is that the OneNote team has
    > consistently implemented asked-for features.  The first one that jumps to
    > mind is the internal hyperlinking.  I'm sorry if your favorite requests
    > haven't materialized yet but in the words of Steven Sinofsky:
    >
    > "Designing Microsoft Office is like ordering pizza for 400 million people.."
    >
    > Can't accommodate every request.  Mine don't always make the final cut
    > either.
    >
    > --
    > -Ben-
    > Ben M. Schorr, MVP
    > Roland Schorr & Towerhttp://www.rolandschorr.comhttp://www.officeforlawyers.com/outlook.html
    > Author: The Lawyer's Guide to Microsoft Outlook 2007:http://tinyurl.com/ol4law-amazon
    >
    > "Michael Moser" <michael.nospam.mo...@nospam.freesurf.ch> wrote in message
    >
    > news:epzwjYbxKHA.3564@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > > "Rainald Taesler" <taes...@gmx.de> wrote in message
    > >news:%23FHAjqgwKHA.5812@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
    > >> > ...
    > >> ON would need anchoring/grouping of objects. This has been requested and
    > >> discussed in the early Beta of ON2007 already.
    > >> Although it's the most seriously missing feature it has not taken up by
    > >> the developers (who set other priorities) and so unfortunately nothing
    > >> has changed in so far in ON2010. We have to wait for at least Office15
    > >> {siiigh}.

    >
    > > So, apparently the same story as with other badly missing features, that
    > > have been requested over and over again...

    >
    > > I wonder why MS takes the effort to announce beta versions of Office
    > > products trying to encourage people to use and comment on it, if they then
    > > don't listen anyway. Based on such experience I didn't even bother to have
    > > a look at the recent ON 2010 beta, since I would bet on the fact that it
    > > won't have those most asked-for features and all requests to add those
    > > will be spoken into the wind anyway... But it will have stronger license
    > > enforcement, that's for sure!

    >
    > > Michael (seeking a replacement for ON - suggestions?)- Hide quoted text-

    >
    > - Show quoted text -


    Hi,

    I've commented before about this obvious omission. The same problem
    occurs when you use the highlighter tool to highlight a printout etc.
    If you then go back and dare to add anything, all your highlighting
    gets shunted down. I can't believe that a note-taking programme should
    have this issue.

    It forces me to take notes in a different way to my normal way (ie the
    MS way).

    That said, the workaround I use (the term workaround should really be
    in ON's marketing, since it's used so often) is to draw or annotate
    your notes, then use the screen clipping tool to copy your annotated
    notes and paste it into a new page.

    It's a shame that some of the obvious and desparately asked for
    features have been ignored by the ON team. Especially as most of the
    features are available in other Office apps (like grouping). They only
    needed to be 'brought across'.

    ON has been around for some time now and even in the 2010 edition,
    we're not seeing our favourite features.

    Dayve
     
  11. John Waller

    John Waller Flightless Bird

    > "Designing Microsoft Office is like ordering pizza for 400 million
    people."

    Exactly the same dilemma faces Adobe for each new version of Photoshop.

    They've responded with a "Just Do It" exercise as part of their
    engineering effort.

    In the words of John Nack (an Adobe PM)

    " By and large we're going to take a break from working on big,
    long-term projects (Cocoa conversion, etc.), and instead all the
    engineers will focus on fixing small, irritating things about the program.

    It's a short, intensive run at low-hanging fruit."

    http://blogs.adobe.com/jnack/2009/06/feedback_please_jdi.html

    I'd love to see Microsoft surprise us all with something similar.
     
  12. Bernd

    Bernd Flightless Bird

    -------- Original-Nachricht --------

    > Well, I'm sorry you feel that way but the fact is that the OneNote team
    > has consistently implemented asked-for features. The first one that
    > jumps to mind is the internal hyperlinking. I'm sorry if your favorite
    > requests haven't materialized yet but in the words of Steven Sinofsky:
    >
    > "Designing Microsoft Office is like ordering pizza for 400 million people."
    >
    > Can't accommodate every request. Mine don't always make the final cut
    > either.
    >


    I'm personally missing that "grouping feature" too.
    But after looking into the data structures of ON with OMSpy I'm sure
    it's not that easy to integrate a "horizontal" bundling of objects (=
    grouping) into that hierarchical data structure.
    I'd like to here from someone at Microsoft if I'm right.

    Bernd
     
  13. Rainald Taesler

    Rainald Taesler Flightless Bird

    Ben M. Schorr, MVP wrote:
    > Well, I'm sorry you feel that way but the fact is that the OneNote
    > team has consistently implemented asked-for features. The first one
    > that jumps to mind is the internal hyperlinking.


    This IMHO is a really one-eyed view!
    Nothing better to offer than a thing which has been implemented in
    ON2007 already??

    Yes, the internal hyperlinks are mist important. Still it has been
    discussed during the ON2007 Beta already that the internal links are
    below what would be possible. Linking does only partly reach what the
    "Organizer" (later "Lotus Organizer") did already have some
    one-and-a-half dozens of years ago :-( :-(

    > I'm sorry if your favorite requests haven't materialized yet but in

    the words of Steven
    > Sinofsky:
    >
    > "Designing Microsoft Office is like ordering pizza for 400 million
    > people."


    But at least the calls from people calling cheese and tomatoes might be
    heard.

    > Can't accommodate every request. Mine don't always make the final cut
    > either.


    IMO ON2007 is anything but a good example of responsiveness.
    Hardly any of the most often asked for things has been implemented in
    the new version.
    The developers just followed different priorities.
    To say with Joni Mitchell's words: ".. clouds got in their way"
    {siiiigh}.

    Sadly yours
    Rainald



    > "Michael Moser" <michael.nospam.moser@nospam.freesurf.ch> wrote in
    > message news:epzwjYbxKHA.3564@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
    >>
    >> "Rainald Taesler" <taesler@gmx.de> wrote in message
    >> news:%23FHAjqgwKHA.5812@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
    >>> > ...
    >>> ON would need anchoring/grouping of objects. This has been
    >>> requested and discussed in the early Beta of ON2007 already.
    >>> Although it's the most seriously missing feature it has not taken
    >>> up by the developers (who set other priorities) and so
    >>> unfortunately nothing has changed in so far in ON2010. We have to
    >>> wait for at least Office15 {siiigh}.

    >>
    >> So, apparently the same story as with other badly missing features,
    >> that have been requested over and over again...
    >>
    >> I wonder why MS takes the effort to announce beta versions of Office
    >> products trying to encourage people to use and comment on it, if
    >> they then don't listen anyway. Based on such experience I didn't
    >> even bother to have a look at the recent ON 2010 beta, since I would
    >> bet on the fact that it won't have those most asked-for features and
    >> all requests to add those will be spoken into the wind anyway... But
    >> it will have stronger license enforcement, that's for sure!
    >>
    >> Michael (seeking a replacement for ON - suggestions?)
     
  14. Rainald Taesler

    Rainald Taesler Flightless Bird

    Bernd wrote:
    >> Well, I'm sorry you feel that way but the fact is that the OneNote
    >> team has consistently implemented asked-for features. The first one
    >> that
    >> jumps to mind is the internal hyperlinking. I'm sorry if your
    >> favorite requests haven't materialized yet but in the words of
    >> Steven Sinofsky:
    >>
    >> "Designing Microsoft Office is like ordering pizza for 400 million
    >> people."
    >>
    >> Can't accommodate every request. Mine don't always make the final
    >> cut either.

    >
    > I'm personally missing that "grouping feature" too.
    > But after looking into the data structures of ON with OMSpy I'm sure
    > it's not that easy to integrate a "horizontal" bundling of objects (=
    > grouping) into that hierarchical data structure.


    I can't say.
    But I am naive enough to thinks that it might be doable some way.

    AFAICS it was just the priorities.
    "Graphics" issues just were not on the agenda.
    That's what Daniel Escapa clearly said last July in the TP-NGs.

    Rainald
     
  15. Rainald Taesler

    Rainald Taesler Flightless Bird

    Michael Moser wrote:
    >I wanted to document all steps to install a larger program package
    > using OneNote by taking "clips" (i.e. partial screenshots) and adding
    > red circles around stuff that I had selected or entered.


    A most common task, for sure.

    > This worked at first quite nice. However, the clips and the drawing
    > elements (ovals) seem to be on different "layers" (or whatever). When
    > I later insert something on that page above, all the screenshots get
    > pushed down (which is what I want and expect) but the red ovals stay
    > where they were and hence now highlight wrong positions and my note
    > thus becomes complete garbage.
    >
    > How can I "merge" or group the images/clips with the drawing elements
    > so that they stick together?


    ON does not have the most urgently needed (and most often asked for)
    feature for grouping and/or at anchoring.
    And this will not be available in ON2010 either. {siiigh}

    Therefore one has to use workarounds.
    The one suggested by "JohnForAmerica" (nice pseudo, BTW <bg>) - i.e.
    working with a screen-clip - works nit is nit too versatile and means a
    loss if quality if the involved images (especially if it's PDFs imported
    into ON.

    I for one prefer different ways:
    a) For commenting PDFs I use the PDFAnnotator (a fantastic tool not only
    but especially for TabletPCs)[1] prior to importing.
    Most PDFs I leave outside ON, however, and just link them. This way I
    can easily change or add comments. And I keep them in Adobe's
    "Portfolio". Huge advantage: Windows Search does easily find the content
    and show it in the Explorer's "Preview Pane" which is not available for
    ON data (the lack of a preview-handler [iFilter] for ON is another
    serious shortcoming <!!>).

    b) For screen-shots I take ON's clipping feature rather seldom and only
    for "easy go lucky" tasks.
    If it's something I want to work on I use SnagIt[2]. This app is a
    professional instrument for taking screen-shots of all kind (incl.
    scrolling windows <!>) and commenting/manipulating those as well as any
    other sort of images. It has a lot of fine drawing tools, tons of stamps
    etc.
    I'm also using it for commenting images held in ON: copy + paste into
    SnagIt, manipulate them there, then copy + paste back into ON.

    c) For easy things the following works fine:
    (aa) Comment/highlight the items in ON;
    (bb) take the "lasso" for marking the whole of the wanted objects;
    (bb) copy the selection and paste it into a graphics tool. My favorite
    in so far is "IrfanView", a fantastic piece of freeware which IMHO is a
    true must-have on each computer ;-);
    (cc) Use copy + paste to bring it back into ON. It's just *one* object
    now.

    All that are just workarounds.
    ON ought to have the basic instruments built-in.
    Shame on the developers team :-(

    Rainald
     
  16. Michael Moser

    Michael Moser Flightless Bird

    "Rainald Taesler" <taesler@gmx.de> wrote in message
    news:uT3IRpGyKHA.812@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
    > >...

    > AFAICS it was just the priorities.
    > "Graphics" issues just were not on the agenda.
    > That's what Daniel Escapa clearly said last July in the TP-NGs.
    >
    > Rainald


    One thing that always puzzled me with ON is:

    why didn't they recycle (parts of) the powerpoint graphics engine? I mean:
    powerpoint 's graphics capabilities are pretty impressive while still being
    fairly easy and straight forward to use.
    PP also supports scribbles and has all these nice drawing functions that one
    expects:
    grouping, connectors (i.e. line-attach-points traveling with an underlying
    element if that gets moved), layers, you name it, while ON's graphics really
    suck! Conceptually speaking: keep the notebook, section (group) and page
    structures (and their handling) but make each ON page a single PP page (or
    "slide").

    And since its part of the same suite one could probably avoid some code
    duplication and -bloating along the way. And millions of users would
    immediately feel "at home" with ON! Beats me why MS is not capitalising on
    this obvious (to me at least...) code re-use possibility.

    M.
     
  17. Bernd

    Bernd Flightless Bird

    -------- Original-Nachricht --------


    > One thing that always puzzled me with ON is:
    >
    > why didn't they recycle (parts of) the powerpoint graphics engine? I
    > mean: powerpoint 's graphics capabilities are pretty impressive while
    > still being fairly easy and straight forward to use.
    > PP also supports scribbles and has all these nice drawing functions that
    > one expects:
    > grouping, connectors (i.e. line-attach-points traveling with an
    > underlying element if that gets moved), layers, you name it, while ON's
    > graphics really suck! Conceptually speaking: keep the notebook, section
    > (group) and page structures (and their handling) but make each ON page a
    > single PP page (or "slide").
    >
    > And since its part of the same suite one could probably avoid some code
    > duplication and -bloating along the way. And millions of users would
    > immediately feel "at home" with ON! Beats me why MS is not capitalising
    > on this obvious (to me at least...) code re-use possibility.
    >
    > M.


    I think the reason behind is that ON has been built as a guerilla
    project outside the Office team and therefore invented the wheel (the
    data model) a second time.

    David vs. Goliath ;-)

    No one at MS thought ON would become a success. So it was hidden in the
    Home and Student Edition where I stumbled upon it, by random.

    Bernd
     
  18. Erik Sojka

    Erik Sojka Flightless Bird

    I imagine they wanted to streamline the note taking process. It would be
    difficult to create a complex diagram using the drawing tools found in
    other Office applications while transcribing a lecture or meeting. If you
    need to create a more complex diagram from those notes later on, MS would
    likely recommend Visio or PowerPoint.


    "Michael Moser" <michael.nospam.moser@nospam.freesurf.ch> wrote in
    news:#DZBJJOzKHA.244@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl:

    > "Rainald Taesler" <taesler@gmx.de> wrote in message
    > news:uT3IRpGyKHA.812@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
    >> >...

    >> AFAICS it was just the priorities.
    >> "Graphics" issues just were not on the agenda.
    >> That's what Daniel Escapa clearly said last July in the TP-NGs.
    >>
    >> Rainald

    >
    > One thing that always puzzled me with ON is:
    >
    > why didn't they recycle (parts of) the powerpoint graphics engine? I
    > mean: powerpoint 's graphics capabilities are pretty impressive while
    > still being fairly easy and straight forward to use.
    > PP also supports scribbles and has all these nice drawing functions
    > that one expects:
    > grouping, connectors (i.e. line-attach-points traveling with an
    > underlying element if that gets moved), layers, you name it, while
    > ON's graphics really suck! Conceptually speaking: keep the notebook,
    > section (group) and page structures (and their handling) but make each
    > ON page a single PP page (or "slide").
    >
    > And since its part of the same suite one could probably avoid some
    > code duplication and -bloating along the way. And millions of users
    > would immediately feel "at home" with ON! Beats me why MS is not
    > capitalising on this obvious (to me at least...) code re-use
    > possibility.
    >
    > M.
    >
     
  19. Ben M. Schorr, MVP

    Ben M. Schorr, MVP Flightless Bird

    Actually I was referring to them implementing it in ON2007. ON2010 has the
    docked view and the Recycle Bin for two feature requests that come to mind.

    I agree that there are some things I would have liked to see in ON2010 that
    didn't make it; to that extent ON2007 may have been a bigger step forward
    than ON2010 is, but ON2010 takes some nice steps forward in shared
    notebooks, versioning and collaboration. Hopefully it sets up for some more
    progress on requested features (like grouping) in the next version.

    Anyhow, I'm simply disagreeing with the premise that the OneNote team never
    implements features people ask for. In fact they very often do - they just
    haven't managed to get every feature in there yet. And yes, there are a
    couple of big ones that are still hanging.

    --
    -Ben-
    Ben M. Schorr, MVP
    Roland Schorr & Tower
    http://www.rolandschorr.com
    http://www.officeforlawyers.com/outlook.html
    Author: The Lawyer's Guide to Microsoft Outlook 2007:
    http://tinyurl.com/ol4law-amazon

    "Rainald Taesler" <taesler@gmx.de> wrote in message
    news:-OsOTQpGyKHA.812@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
    > Ben M. Schorr, MVP wrote:
    >> Well, I'm sorry you feel that way but the fact is that the OneNote
    >> team has consistently implemented asked-for features. The first one
    >> that jumps to mind is the internal hyperlinking.

    >
    > This IMHO is a really one-eyed view!
    > Nothing better to offer than a thing which has been implemented in
    > ON2007 already??
    >
    > Yes, the internal hyperlinks are mist important. Still it has been
    > discussed during the ON2007 Beta already that the internal links are
    > below what would be possible. Linking does only partly reach what the
    > "Organizer" (later "Lotus Organizer") did already have some
    > one-and-a-half dozens of years ago :-( :-(
    >
    >> I'm sorry if your favorite requests haven't materialized yet but in

    > the words of Steven
    >> Sinofsky:
    >>
    >> "Designing Microsoft Office is like ordering pizza for 400 million
    >> people."

    >
    > But at least the calls from people calling cheese and tomatoes might be
    > heard.
    >
    >> Can't accommodate every request. Mine don't always make the final cut
    >> either.

    >
    > IMO ON2007 is anything but a good example of responsiveness.
    > Hardly any of the most often asked for things has been implemented in
    > the new version.
    > The developers just followed different priorities.
    > To say with Joni Mitchell's words: ".. clouds got in their way"
    > {siiiigh}.
    >
    > Sadly yours
    > Rainald
    >
    >
    >
    >> "Michael Moser" <michael.nospam.moser@nospam.freesurf.ch> wrote in
    >> message news:epzwjYbxKHA.3564@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
    >>>
    >>> "Rainald Taesler" <taesler@gmx.de> wrote in message
    >>> news:%23FHAjqgwKHA.5812@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
    >>>> > ...
    >>>> ON would need anchoring/grouping of objects. This has been
    >>>> requested and discussed in the early Beta of ON2007 already.
    >>>> Although it's the most seriously missing feature it has not taken
    >>>> up by the developers (who set other priorities) and so
    >>>> unfortunately nothing has changed in so far in ON2010. We have to
    >>>> wait for at least Office15 {siiigh}.
    >>>
    >>> So, apparently the same story as with other badly missing features,
    >>> that have been requested over and over again...
    >>>
    >>> I wonder why MS takes the effort to announce beta versions of Office
    >>> products trying to encourage people to use and comment on it, if
    >>> they then don't listen anyway. Based on such experience I didn't
    >>> even bother to have a look at the recent ON 2010 beta, since I would
    >>> bet on the fact that it won't have those most asked-for features and
    >>> all requests to add those will be spoken into the wind anyway... But
    >>> it will have stronger license enforcement, that's for sure!
    >>>
    >>> Michael (seeking a replacement for ON - suggestions?)

    >
     

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