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Bootable copy of XP partition.

S

surferdude2

Flightless Bird
Bob Taylor;1223943 Wrote:
> Regards to All,
>
> Win XP SP2
>
> I have two hard drives, each partitioned. The first drive has the XP
> partition (C) and a partition (E) with all my data. One partition on
> my second drive (D) has backup and archive files. The others are
> unused.
>
> I want to make a bootable copy of my c drive onto the first (unused)
> partition of the second drive without destroying the archive and
> backup partition (D).
>
> What program can do this?
>
> Acronis cannot do this and I have been assured that EASEUS Data
> Backup & Recovery cannot do it either. (Both of these want to destroy
>
> the whole drive)
>
> I used to do this regularly with Win 98 using PowerQuest Partition
> Magic, but this was bought by Norton and is no longer available which
> is a shame because it was a very good program. I still have a copy of
>
> the old Partition Magic, but it will not copy a XP boot partition.
>
> Thanks for your attention to my problem,
> Bob Taylor
> philologos at mindspring dot com


I use http://www.xxclone.com/ for that and it has never failed me. It
has several other nice features as well.
 
B

Bob Taylor

Flightless Bird
dadiOH wrote:
> Bob Taylor wrote:
>> Paul wrote:
>>> Easeus Partition Master comes in a free version. No idea what
>>> feature set.

>> As I mentioned, this will not creat a bootable partition. I have been
>> assured by the support people that they cannot guarantee the copy will
>> be bootable.
>>
>> One can google and finds dozens, maybe hundreds, of programs which
>> will copy disks, but which one will do what I want, make a bootable xp
>> partition without reformating the entire target disk?

>
> The simplest thing is to just install another (minimal) XP to the partition.
> Doing so will create a boot menu from which you can boot should the
> need/desire arise. To avoid confusion, you could rename the new XP install
> to something like "XP - Basic" in the boot menu.
>
> Alterntively, you can copy the existing XP and make a bootable CD.
>
> You might also want to check out Paragon Hard Drive Manager, it will clone
> one HD or partition to another. The same is true of the programs
> distributed along with HDs by manufacturers.
> http://www.paragon-software.com/home/hdm-personal/features.html
>


I have been looking at their web page and it seems one of their
products may do the job. They also claim to boot from external usb
drives and to be able to boot on different hardware, which could be
extremely handy.

Can you recommend this vendor?

Regards,
Bob Taylor
philologos at mindspring dot com
 
D

dadiOH

Flightless Bird
Bob Taylor wrote:

>> You might also want to check out Paragon Hard Drive Manager, it will
>> clone one HD or partition to another. The same is true of the
>> programs distributed along with HDs by manufacturers.
>> http://www.paragon-software.com/home/hdm-personal/features.html
>>

>
> I have been looking at their web page and it seems one of their
> products may do the job. They also claim to boot from external usb
> drives and to be able to boot on different hardware, which could be
> extremely handy.
>
> Can you recommend this vendor?


Well, I can. That's why I mentioned them. Long ago I had Partition Magic
AND TrueImage...needed both because neither did everything (at the time). I
dumped both and went with Paragon. It did everything and I saved a bunch of
HD space.

No comment re the USB and different hardware, never had the need for either.



--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

Flightless Bird
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 23:58:20 -0400, mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com>
wrote:

> On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 14:00:24 -0700, "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >I am not an MVP nor even a techie wannabe

>
> Well I know far less than any of you, but I got the impression that an
> array of two SATA drives, set to keep one identical to the other, is
> done in order to have an always present backup.
>
> A friend gave me a mobo and two SATA drives, but I havent' yet
> assembled a computer around it.
>
> If I eventually do, won't I have my HD backup, like the OP wants?



What you are planning on doing is the weakest form of backup there is.
I don't recommend backup to a second non-removable hard drive because
it leaves you susceptible to simultaneous loss of the original and
backup to many of the most common dangers: severe power glitches,
nearby lightning strikes, virus attacks, even theft of the computer.

In my view, secure backup needs to be on removable media, and not kept
in the computer. For really secure backup (needed, for example, if the
life of your business depends on your data) you should have multiple
generations of backup, and at least one of those generations should be
stored off-site.


--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP (Windows Desktop Experience) since 2003
Please Reply to the Newsgroup
 
M

mm

Flightless Bird
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 23:44:33 -0700, "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net>
wrote:

>Yes, you will have the major elements to have a "hot spare" backup by having
>the 2 SATA drives installed in internal HD positions 1 and 2. Drive 2 must
>be at least as large as drive 1 and be properly formatted. Then all you
>have to do is clone your position 1 "C" drive to your position 2 drive using
>a good clone app of which there are several - some even freeware.


I also thought that if I set it up as an "array", whatever that is, it
would automatically write the same things to each drive at the same
time, within a second or two.

I appreciate Ken's warning, and I would continue to have an external
backup, but I liked this idea SATA array idea, because I thought it
would be automatic.

> I know
>that this results in a bootable hot spare because I have been using this
>configuration for about 2 years, as well as an externally SATA drive mounted
>in a VanTec enclosure which is also bootable. I have also tried connecting
>this externally mounted HD via a USB2 connection and it was bootable also.


I don't understand this. I assumed the USB port couldn't do anything
until after the OS booted, and by then it was already booted and
couldn't boot from the USB device.

>I prefer to use the SATA3 connection as it seems faster.
>
>Again, there are many ways to have a bootable backup but if you already have
>a proper MOBO and two SATA drives, and get a good clone app, IMHO, nothing
>could be simpler.
>
>
>"mm" <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
>news:qf1326lbku2dqgavo08149tipmve9mkqka@4ax.com...
>On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 14:00:24 -0700, "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net>
>wrote:
>
>>
>>I am not an MVP nor even a techie wannabe

>
>Well I know far less than any of you, but I got the impression that an
>array of two SATA drives, set to keep one identical to the other, is
>done in order to have an always present backup.
>
>A friend gave me a mobo and two SATA drives, but I havent' yet
>assembled a computer around it.
>
>If I eventually do, won't I have my HD backup, like the OP wants?
>
 
B

bobster

Flightless Bird
Ken,

An internal second drive backup does have some of the potential
disadvantages that you mention. My personal belief and experience is that
those occurrences are very rare (Except for a virus attack, I've never had
one of those things happen). Much more likely for the average home user is
non-recoverable "C" drive crash, a virus infestation, a drive physical
failure or a self induced screw up by visiting a "bad" site or opening an
infected email attachment. Reversion to an internal second drive would
allow recovery from any or all of those. Thus I don't consider it the
weakest of all backup forms, in fact I have found it to be a very good
approach and have used it to "recover" many times.

That being said, I agree with you that there are better forms of backup. My
personal "best choice" --- a belt, suspenders and thumb-tack approach, and
the one I use myself is:

1) A second internal HD, physically identical to the "C" drive.

2) A third, physically identical HD mounted in an external eSATA enclosure

3) A fourth HD stored in my bank safe deposit box. (protects against
computer theft or home fire)

Using a good clone app (I use Casper 6.0), I clone my "C" drive to the
second internal and external drives about once a week. About every 6
months, I insert my fourth HD into the external enclosure and clone my "C"
drive to it, then return it to my safe deposit box.

All HDs are WD 320gig drives, about $50 each, and the external enclosure is
a VanTec eSATA unit $35-40.

Sounds complicated but in fact is really quite simple. The cost of the
extra hardware is not trivial, but for me, the peace of mind is well worth
it. As I said in a previous post, a very valuable side benefit is that I
can do all the experimenting, fooling around, etc. I want with my "C" drive
with the knowledge that recovery is just a click or two away.

As an aside, thanks for all of your past posts and good advice. Hope they
will continue in the future regardless of what MS does with their forums.




"Ken Blake, MVP" <kblake@this.is.an.invalid.domain> wrote in message
news:jo9426hdhef9uhacmg5jnburj3cuhgktlj@4ax.com...
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 23:58:20 -0400, mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com>
wrote:

> On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 14:00:24 -0700, "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >I am not an MVP nor even a techie wannabe

>
> Well I know far less than any of you, but I got the impression that an
> array of two SATA drives, set to keep one identical to the other, is
> done in order to have an always present backup.
>
> A friend gave me a mobo and two SATA drives, but I havent' yet
> assembled a computer around it.
>
> If I eventually do, won't I have my HD backup, like the OP wants?



What you are planning on doing is the weakest form of backup there is.
I don't recommend backup to a second non-removable hard drive because
it leaves you susceptible to simultaneous loss of the original and
backup to many of the most common dangers: severe power glitches,
nearby lightning strikes, virus attacks, even theft of the computer.

In my view, secure backup needs to be on removable media, and not kept
in the computer. For really secure backup (needed, for example, if the
life of your business depends on your data) you should have multiple
generations of backup, and at least one of those generations should be
stored off-site.


--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP (Windows Desktop Experience) since 2003
Please Reply to the Newsgroup
 
B

bobster

Flightless Bird
Daave,

You said,

"If you plug a usb hard drive
> in and reboot, it does not see the drive until XP has loaded. Too
> late to boot it.
>
> Love to know how to get around that.

"

I only used the USB2 approach once to clone my "C" drive to a second drive
located in an external enclosure. As I recall, I then physically removed
the HD from the enclosure and installed it into the second internal slot and
it booted just fine. Thus, the only use of the USB2 link was to make the
clone, not to subsequently boot from the enclosure via the USB2 link. The
point being that one can make an HD clone using a USB2 link but that to use
that clone as a boot device, it must be connected either via an eSATA link
or physically installed in an internal HD slot. I subsequently discovered
the eSATA cable that came with the enclosure and used it from that point on.

I have heard that some clone apps now have the ability to make bootable
clones via USB2 links using an external enclosure and also to boot directly
via the USB2 link. Don't know how they do it.



"Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
news:e3ZirLkELHA.4816@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
Inline.

Bob Taylor wrote:
> bobster wrote:
>> Bob,
>>
>> Maybe I'm missing something here but it looks like you are making a
>> fairly simple problem way too difficult. You definitely can boot
>> from an externally mounted HD.


bobster, often this is not the case!!!

> What you are missing is that I was told this and have actually tried
> it, but perhaps you know a way around. If you plug a usb hard drive
> in and reboot, it does not see the drive until XP has loaded. Too
> late to boot it.
>
> Love to know how to get around that.


Bob:

People have had mixed success with making ordinary USB external hard
drives bootable (it's rarely recommended). The motherboard and BIOS must
support the method and you would need to configure the BIOS correctly.

The easiest way to do this is to use an eSATA hard drive (of course the
motherboard must support eSATA).

How about telling us about your hardware?
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

Flightless Bird
On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 11:28:00 -0700, "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net>
wrote:

> Ken,
>
> An internal second drive backup does have some of the potential
> disadvantages that you mention. My personal belief and experience is that
> those occurrences are very rare (Except for a virus attack, I've never had
> one of those things happen). Much more likely for the average home user is
> non-recoverable "C" drive crash, a virus infestation, a drive physical
> failure or a self induced screw up by visiting a "bad" site or opening an
> infected email attachment. Reversion to an internal second drive would
> allow recovery from any or all of those. Thus I don't consider it the
> weakest of all backup forms, in fact I have found it to be a very good
> approach and have used it to "recover" many times.



Then we disagree there. But considering what you say below, we don't
seem to disagree all that much.


> That being said, I agree with you that there are better forms of backup. My
> personal "best choice" --- a belt, suspenders and thumb-tack approach, and
> the one I use myself is:
>
> 1) A second internal HD, physically identical to the "C" drive.
>
> 2) A third, physically identical HD mounted in an external eSATA enclosure
>
> 3) A fourth HD stored in my bank safe deposit box. (protects against
> computer theft or home fire)



Since you do 2 and 3 as well as 1, we're actually pretty close in our
opinions.


> As an aside, thanks for all of your past posts and good advice.



You're welcome, and thanks very much for the kind words.


> Hope they will continue in the future regardless of what MS does with their forums.



We'll see what happens with the newsgroups. I'm spending more time now
in the web-based Microsoft forums (using the NNTP Bridges), and I'm
afraid that these newsgroups may gradually peter out.


--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP (Windows Desktop Experience) since 2003
Please Reply to the Newsgroup
 
M

mm

Flightless Bird
On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 13:28:36 -0700, "Ken Blake, MVP"
<kblake@this.is.an.invalid.domain> wrote:

>On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 11:28:00 -0700, "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net>
>wrote:
>
>> Ken,
>>
>> An internal second drive backup does have some of the potential
>> disadvantages that you mention. My personal belief and experience is that
>> those occurrences are very rare (Except for a virus attack, I've never had
>> one of those things happen). Much more likely for the average home user is
>> non-recoverable "C" drive crash, a virus infestation, a drive physical
>> failure or a self induced screw up by visiting a "bad" site or opening an
>> infected email attachment.


And I've wondered about some of these things tooo. If no drive fails
but I screw up my data on the first drive, how long before the second
drive is just as screwed up? If the duplicating is automatic, it
sounds like it will happen in a few seconds, and for sure, before I
have time to stop it. So a second drive in an array would only be
protection against the physical failure of the first drive, right?

>> Reversion to an internal second drive would
>> allow recovery from any or all of those. Thus I don't consider it the
>> weakest of all backup forms, in fact I have found it to be a very good
>> approach and have used it to "recover" many times.

>
>> That being said, I agree with you that there are better forms of backup. My
>> personal "best choice" --- a belt, suspenders and thumb-tack approach, and
>> the one I use myself is:
>>
>> 1) A second internal HD, physically identical to the "C" drive.
>>
>> 2) A third, physically identical HD mounted in an external eSATA enclosure
>>
>> 3) A fourth HD stored in my bank safe deposit box. (protects against
>> computer theft or home fire)

>
>
>Since you do 2 and 3 as well as 1, we're actually pretty close in our
>opinions.
>
>
>> As an aside, thanks for all of your past posts and good advice.

>
>
>You're welcome, and thanks very much for the kind words.
>
>
>> Hope they will continue in the future regardless of what MS does with their forums.

>
>We'll see what happens with the newsgroups. I'm spending more time now
>in the web-based Microsoft forums (using the NNTP Bridges), and I'm
>afraid that these newsgroups may gradually peter out.


I sure hope not. Newsgroups are far more efficient that web forums,
allow easy saving of replies on one's own computers for future
referecne, and work for people with dial-up, just as well as with
highspeed.

A lot of people I think don't know about newgroups and we shoudl tell
people.
 
B

bobster

Flightless Bird
mm,

You said,

"And I've wondered about some of these things too. If no drive fails
but I screw up my data on the first drive, how long before the second
drive is just as screwed up? If the duplicating is automatic, it
sounds like it will happen in a few seconds, and for sure, before I
have time to stop it. So a second drive in an array would only be
protection against the physical failure of the first drive, right?


Good points and the very reason why I don't do automatic "duplicating", to
use your term. As I said in a previous post, I manually update (re-clone)
my "C" drive to my second internal HD and the external HD weekly as long as
the "C" drive is exhibiting no problems. This puts a known good
configuration on those drives. However, before I do this weekly re-clone
operation, I run full Malwarebytes and SUPERAntiSpyware scans to ensure
that I do in fact have a "clean" "C" drive configuration. I also run
Microsoft Security Essentials and the MS Firewall full time.

In the event of a non-correctable "C" drive problem, I boot up to one of the
other HD drives, then manually clone it back to the "C" drive. Unless there
has been a hardware failure of the "C" drive, this action puts me back in
business with a "clean" "C" drive configuration. The clone app I use
(Casper 6.0) typically takes 5-7 minutes to do a clone operation after a
one-time "learning" run.

Word of caution. It is essential that one has a "clean" "C" drive
configuration before cloning it to the other HDs or else a bad configuration
can be perpetuated in the those drives. That's why I run MSE+Windows
firewall full time, and updated Malwarebytes and SUPERAntiSpyware before
each cloning operation.

============================================================.
"mm" <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:fqa526d5n7921q0b4ssri0hq5sbep3okl5@4ax.com...
On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 13:28:36 -0700, "Ken Blake, MVP"
<kblake@this.is.an.invalid.domain> wrote:

>On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 11:28:00 -0700, "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net>
>wrote:
>
>> Ken,
>>
>> An internal second drive backup does have some of the potential
>> disadvantages that you mention. My personal belief and experience is
>> that
>> those occurrences are very rare (Except for a virus attack, I've never
>> had
>> one of those things happen). Much more likely for the average home user
>> is
>> non-recoverable "C" drive crash, a virus infestation, a drive physical
>> failure or a self induced screw up by visiting a "bad" site or opening an
>> infected email attachment.


And I've wondered about some of these things tooo. If no drive fails
but I screw up my data on the first drive, how long before the second
drive is just as screwed up? If the duplicating is automatic, it
sounds like it will happen in a few seconds, and for sure, before I
have time to stop it. So a second drive in an array would only be
protection against the physical failure of the first drive, right?

>> Reversion to an internal second drive would
>> allow recovery from any or all of those. Thus I don't consider it the
>> weakest of all backup forms, in fact I have found it to be a very good
>> approach and have used it to "recover" many times.

>
>> That being said, I agree with you that there are better forms of backup.
>> My
>> personal "best choice" --- a belt, suspenders and thumb-tack approach,
>> and
>> the one I use myself is:
>>
>> 1) A second internal HD, physically identical to the "C" drive.
>>
>> 2) A third, physically identical HD mounted in an external eSATA
>> enclosure
>>
>> 3) A fourth HD stored in my bank safe deposit box. (protects against
>> computer theft or home fire)

>
>
>Since you do 2 and 3 as well as 1, we're actually pretty close in our
>opinions.
>
>
>> As an aside, thanks for all of your past posts and good advice.

>
>
>You're welcome, and thanks very much for the kind words.
>
>
>> Hope they will continue in the future regardless of what MS does with
>> their forums.

>
>We'll see what happens with the newsgroups. I'm spending more time now
>in the web-based Microsoft forums (using the NNTP Bridges), and I'm
>afraid that these newsgroups may gradually peter out.


I sure hope not. Newsgroups are far more efficient that web forums,
allow easy saving of replies on one's own computers for future
referecne, and work for people with dial-up, just as well as with
highspeed.

A lot of people I think don't know about newgroups and we shoudl tell
people.
 
M

mm

Flightless Bird
On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 20:32:59 -0700, "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net>
wrote:

>mm,
>
>You said,
>
>"And I've wondered about some of these things too. If no drive fails
>but I screw up my data on the first drive, how long before the second
>drive is just as screwed up? If the duplicating is automatic, it
>sounds like it will happen in a few seconds, and for sure, before I
>have time to stop it. So a second drive in an array would only be
>protection against the physical failure of the first drive, right?
>
>
>Good points and the very reason why I don't do automatic "duplicating", to
>use your term. As I said in a previous post, I manually update (re-clone)


Okay. I thought that was a flaw, but yet some things pushed this
automatic simultaneous updates as if it were very valuable, without
mentioning the flaws.

Thanks for this and the rest.


>my "C" drive to my second internal HD and the external HD weekly as long as
>the "C" drive is exhibiting no problems. This puts a known good
>configuration on those drives. However, before I do this weekly re-clone
>operation, I run full Malwarebytes and SUPERAntiSpyware scans to ensure
>that I do in fact have a "clean" "C" drive configuration. I also run
>Microsoft Security Essentials and the MS Firewall full time.
>
>In the event of a non-correctable "C" drive problem, I boot up to one of the
>other HD drives, then manually clone it back to the "C" drive. Unless there
>has been a hardware failure of the "C" drive, this action puts me back in
>business with a "clean" "C" drive configuration. The clone app I use
>(Casper 6.0) typically takes 5-7 minutes to do a clone operation after a
>one-time "learning" run.
>
>Word of caution. It is essential that one has a "clean" "C" drive
>configuration before cloning it to the other HDs or else a bad configuration
>can be perpetuated in the those drives. That's why I run MSE+Windows
>firewall full time, and updated Malwarebytes and SUPERAntiSpyware before
>each cloning operation.
>
>============================================================.
>"mm" <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
>news:fqa526d5n7921q0b4ssri0hq5sbep3okl5@4ax.com...
>On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 13:28:36 -0700, "Ken Blake, MVP"
><kblake@this.is.an.invalid.domain> wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 11:28:00 -0700, "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net>
>>wrote:
>>
>>> Ken,
>>>
>>> An internal second drive backup does have some of the potential
>>> disadvantages that you mention. My personal belief and experience is
>>> that
>>> those occurrences are very rare (Except for a virus attack, I've never
>>> had
>>> one of those things happen). Much more likely for the average home user
>>> is
>>> non-recoverable "C" drive crash, a virus infestation, a drive physical
>>> failure or a self induced screw up by visiting a "bad" site or opening an
>>> infected email attachment.

>
>And I've wondered about some of these things tooo. If no drive fails
>but I screw up my data on the first drive, how long before the second
>drive is just as screwed up? If the duplicating is automatic, it
>sounds like it will happen in a few seconds, and for sure, before I
>have time to stop it. So a second drive in an array would only be
>protection against the physical failure of the first drive, right?
>
>>> Reversion to an internal second drive would
>>> allow recovery from any or all of those. Thus I don't consider it the
>>> weakest of all backup forms, in fact I have found it to be a very good
>>> approach and have used it to "recover" many times.

>>
>>> That being said, I agree with you that there are better forms of backup.
>>> My
>>> personal "best choice" --- a belt, suspenders and thumb-tack approach,
>>> and
>>> the one I use myself is:
>>>
>>> 1) A second internal HD, physically identical to the "C" drive.
>>>
>>> 2) A third, physically identical HD mounted in an external eSATA
>>> enclosure
>>>
>>> 3) A fourth HD stored in my bank safe deposit box. (protects against
>>> computer theft or home fire)

>>
>>
>>Since you do 2 and 3 as well as 1, we're actually pretty close in our
>>opinions.
>>
>>
>>> As an aside, thanks for all of your past posts and good advice.

>>
>>
>>You're welcome, and thanks very much for the kind words.
>>
>>
>>> Hope they will continue in the future regardless of what MS does with
>>> their forums.

>>
>>We'll see what happens with the newsgroups. I'm spending more time now
>>in the web-based Microsoft forums (using the NNTP Bridges), and I'm
>>afraid that these newsgroups may gradually peter out.

>
>I sure hope not. Newsgroups are far more efficient that web forums,
>allow easy saving of replies on one's own computers for future
>referecne, and work for people with dial-up, just as well as with
>highspeed.
>
>A lot of people I think don't know about newgroups and we shoudl tell
>people.
>
 
D

Daave

Flightless Bird
bobster wrote:
> Daave,
>
> You said,
>
>> "If you plug a usb hard drive
>> in and reboot, it does not see the drive until XP has loaded. Too
>> late to boot it.


No, I didn't say that. I said this:

People have had mixed success with making ordinary USB external hard
drives bootable (it's rarely recommended). The motherboard and BIOS must
support the method and you would need to configure the BIOS correctly.

The easiest way to do this is to use an eSATA hard drive (of course the
motherboard must support eSATA).

How about telling us about your hardware?
 
B

bobster

Flightless Bird
Sorry, Dave, that quote was from a post by Paul Taylor.

My hardware configuration is described in another post on this topic. It is
an all SATA3 setup including an eSATA external enclosure for a third drive.

=================================================
"Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
news:uPilsu6ELHA.4120@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
bobster wrote:
> Daave,
>
> You said,
>
>> "If you plug a usb hard drive
>> in and reboot, it does not see the drive until XP has loaded. Too
>> late to boot it.


No, I didn't say that. I said this:

People have had mixed success with making ordinary USB external hard
drives bootable (it's rarely recommended). The motherboard and BIOS must
support the method and you would need to configure the BIOS correctly.

The easiest way to do this is to use an eSATA hard drive (of course the
motherboard must support eSATA).

How about telling us about your hardware?
 
B

bobster

Flightless Bird
OOPS,

Previous post should have read, That quote was from a post by "Paul", not
Paul Taylor

"bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net> wrote in message
news:i005j9$tcc$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Sorry, Dave, that quote was from a post by Paul Taylor.

My hardware configuration is described in another post on this topic. It is
an all SATA3 setup including an eSATA external enclosure for a third drive.

=================================================
"Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
news:uPilsu6ELHA.4120@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
bobster wrote:
> Daave,
>
> You said,
>
>> "If you plug a usb hard drive
>> in and reboot, it does not see the drive until XP has loaded. Too
>> late to boot it.


No, I didn't say that. I said this:

People have had mixed success with making ordinary USB external hard
drives bootable (it's rarely recommended). The motherboard and BIOS must
support the method and you would need to configure the BIOS correctly.

The easiest way to do this is to use an eSATA hard drive (of course the
motherboard must support eSATA).

How about telling us about your hardware?
 
D

Daave

Flightless Bird
It would be helpful to know the make and model of your motherboard and
your BIOS version.(If this information is in another post, I didn't see
it.)

Cloning a drive and making it a bootable choice in real time is
ordinarily an easy task. But if your external eSATA enclosure is hooked
up via USB rather than via the SATA connection (which would be the case
if your motherboard does not support eSATA), you have a very different
situation.

Or is your goal disaster recovery without the need for an *instant* boot
(this method is preferred by people like day traders who can't afford a
wasted second)? If so, creating an image of the drive would serve that
purpose because once the image is restored, you will wind up with a
bootable drive anyway.

bobster wrote:
> OOPS,
>
> Previous post should have read, That quote was from a post by "Paul",
> not Paul Taylor
>
> "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net> wrote in message
> news:i005j9$tcc$1@news.eternal-september.org...
> Sorry, Dave, that quote was from a post by Paul Taylor.
>
> My hardware configuration is described in another post on this topic.
> It is an all SATA3 setup including an eSATA external enclosure for a
> third drive.
>
> =================================================
> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
> news:uPilsu6ELHA.4120@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> bobster wrote:
>> Daave,
>>
>> You said,
>>
>>> "If you plug a usb hard drive
>>> in and reboot, it does not see the drive until XP has loaded. Too
>>> late to boot it.

>
> No, I didn't say that. I said this:
>
> People have had mixed success with making ordinary USB external hard
> drives bootable (it's rarely recommended). The motherboard and BIOS
> must support the method and you would need to configure the BIOS
> correctly.
>
> The easiest way to do this is to use an eSATA hard drive (of course
> the motherboard must support eSATA).
>
> How about telling us about your hardware?
 
B

bobster

Flightless Bird
Daave,

My external enclosure is connected via an eSATA cable to the third SATA port
of the motherboard in my Dell Inspiron 530 computer (circa (2007). Thus I
am able to easily boot from the "C" clone HD in this enclosure.

When I first installed this enclosure, I connected it via a USB2 port and
was able to clone my "C" drive to it. But in order to use this as a
bootable HD, I had to physically remove it and install it into the second
internal HD slot. Worked fine but was inconvenient. I finally RTFM and
discovered that the extra cable that came with the enclosure was an eSATA
cable. After using it to connect to the extra SATA port on my MOBO, I was
able to boot directly from the HD in the enclosure -- just like having a
third internal HD slot but located externally.

In my previous posts I described how I have used this setup for the last 2
years. While it doesn't support an "instant" re- boot, I can re-boot into
the external HD or the second internal slot HD in the time it takes for my
computer to do a re-boot -- generally under one minute.

======================================================.
"Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
news:us6uuf8ELHA.2276@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
It would be helpful to know the make and model of your motherboard and
your BIOS version.(If this information is in another post, I didn't see
it.)

Cloning a drive and making it a bootable choice in real time is
ordinarily an easy task. But if your external eSATA enclosure is hooked
up via USB rather than via the SATA connection (which would be the case
if your motherboard does not support eSATA), you have a very different
situation.

Or is your goal disaster recovery without the need for an *instant* boot
(this method is preferred by people like day traders who can't afford a
wasted second)? If so, creating an image of the drive would serve that
purpose because once the image is restored, you will wind up with a
bootable drive anyway.

bobster wrote:
> OOPS,
>
> Previous post should have read, That quote was from a post by "Paul",
> not Paul Taylor
>
> "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net> wrote in message
> news:i005j9$tcc$1@news.eternal-september.org...
> Sorry, Dave, that quote was from a post by Paul Taylor.
>
> My hardware configuration is described in another post on this topic.
> It is an all SATA3 setup including an eSATA external enclosure for a
> third drive.
>
> =================================================
> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
> news:uPilsu6ELHA.4120@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> bobster wrote:
>> Daave,
>>
>> You said,
>>
>>> "If you plug a usb hard drive
>>> in and reboot, it does not see the drive until XP has loaded. Too
>>> late to boot it.

>
> No, I didn't say that. I said this:
>
> People have had mixed success with making ordinary USB external hard
> drives bootable (it's rarely recommended). The motherboard and BIOS
> must support the method and you would need to configure the BIOS
> correctly.
>
> The easiest way to do this is to use an eSATA hard drive (of course
> the motherboard must support eSATA).
>
> How about telling us about your hardware?
 
B

bobster

Flightless Bird
Daave,

Update on my previous post:

Just for kicks I temporarily reconnected my external HD enclosure via a USB2
cable rather than the eSATA cable. The enclosure contained a HD that had
previously been cloned from my "C" drive. I started the boot sequence,
pressed F12 to get to the boot order in the BIOS and lo and behold, the USB2
connected drive showed up as a bootable option. I selected it, and
continued the boot sequence and my computer successfully booted to it. It
took a bit longer (~20 additional seconds) to boot when compared to the
eSATA connected one, but the point is that it did boot directly from a USB2
connected HD. Surprised me.

======================================================
"bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net> wrote in message
news:i00a9l$j4s$1@news.eternal-september.org...
Daave,

My external enclosure is connected via an eSATA cable to the third SATA port
of the motherboard in my Dell Inspiron 530 computer (circa (2007). Thus I
am able to easily boot from the "C" clone HD in this enclosure.

When I first installed this enclosure, I connected it via a USB2 port and
was able to clone my "C" drive to it. But in order to use this as a
bootable HD, I had to physically remove it and install it into the second
internal HD slot. Worked fine but was inconvenient. I finally RTFM and
discovered that the extra cable that came with the enclosure was an eSATA
cable. After using it to connect to the extra SATA port on my MOBO, I was
able to boot directly from the HD in the enclosure -- just like having a
third internal HD slot but located externally.

In my previous posts I described how I have used this setup for the last 2
years. While it doesn't support an "instant" re- boot, I can re-boot into
the external HD or the second internal slot HD in the time it takes for my
computer to do a re-boot -- generally under one minute.

======================================================.
"Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
news:us6uuf8ELHA.2276@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
It would be helpful to know the make and model of your motherboard and
your BIOS version.(If this information is in another post, I didn't see
it.)

Cloning a drive and making it a bootable choice in real time is
ordinarily an easy task. But if your external eSATA enclosure is hooked
up via USB rather than via the SATA connection (which would be the case
if your motherboard does not support eSATA), you have a very different
situation.

Or is your goal disaster recovery without the need for an *instant* boot
(this method is preferred by people like day traders who can't afford a
wasted second)? If so, creating an image of the drive would serve that
purpose because once the image is restored, you will wind up with a
bootable drive anyway.

bobster wrote:
> OOPS,
>
> Previous post should have read, That quote was from a post by "Paul",
> not Paul Taylor
>
> "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net> wrote in message
> news:i005j9$tcc$1@news.eternal-september.org...
> Sorry, Dave, that quote was from a post by Paul Taylor.
>
> My hardware configuration is described in another post on this topic.
> It is an all SATA3 setup including an eSATA external enclosure for a
> third drive.
>
> =================================================
> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
> news:uPilsu6ELHA.4120@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> bobster wrote:
>> Daave,
>>
>> You said,
>>
>>> "If you plug a usb hard drive
>>> in and reboot, it does not see the drive until XP has loaded. Too
>>> late to boot it.

>
> No, I didn't say that. I said this:
>
> People have had mixed success with making ordinary USB external hard
> drives bootable (it's rarely recommended). The motherboard and BIOS
> must support the method and you would need to configure the BIOS
> correctly.
>
> The easiest way to do this is to use an eSATA hard drive (of course
> the motherboard must support eSATA).
>
> How about telling us about your hardware?
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

Flightless Bird
On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 20:56:02 -0400, mm <NOPSAMmm2005@bigfoot.com>
wrote:

> >We'll see what happens with the newsgroups. I'm spending more time now
> >in the web-based Microsoft forums (using the NNTP Bridges), and I'm
> >afraid that these newsgroups may gradually peter out.

>
> I sure hope not. Newsgroups are far more efficient that web forums,
> allow easy saving of replies on one's own computers for future
> referecne, and work for people with dial-up, just as well as with
> highspeed.



I'm with you entirely, but I'm still pessimistic.

And don't forget that you can use your newsreader with the Microsoft
web-based forums and the NNTP bridges. That gets back at least some of
the advantages of newsgroups.

--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP (Windows Desktop Experience) since 2003
Please Reply to the Newsgroup
 
D

Daave

Flightless Bird
Thanks for the clarification, bobster. Apparntly, I misread your initial
post.

Did you find an answer to your original question? I've never use it, but
I believe Casper can do the type of cloning you are looking to do. And
the added bonus is that it also does incremental cloning (another thing
Acronis can't do).

bobster wrote:
> Daave,
>
> Update on my previous post:
>
> Just for kicks I temporarily reconnected my external HD enclosure via
> a USB2 cable rather than the eSATA cable. The enclosure contained a
> HD that had previously been cloned from my "C" drive. I started the
> boot sequence, pressed F12 to get to the boot order in the BIOS and
> lo and behold, the USB2 connected drive showed up as a bootable
> option. I selected it, and continued the boot sequence and my
> computer successfully booted to it. It took a bit longer (~20
> additional seconds) to boot when compared to the eSATA connected
> one, but the point is that it did boot directly from a USB2 connected
> HD. Surprised me.
>
> ======================================================
> "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net> wrote in message
> news:i00a9l$j4s$1@news.eternal-september.org...
> Daave,
>
> My external enclosure is connected via an eSATA cable to the third
> SATA port of the motherboard in my Dell Inspiron 530 computer (circa
> (2007). Thus I am able to easily boot from the "C" clone HD in this
> enclosure.
>
> When I first installed this enclosure, I connected it via a USB2 port
> and was able to clone my "C" drive to it. But in order to use this
> as a bootable HD, I had to physically remove it and install it into
> the second internal HD slot. Worked fine but was inconvenient. I
> finally RTFM and discovered that the extra cable that came with the
> enclosure was an eSATA cable. After using it to connect to the extra
> SATA port on my MOBO, I was able to boot directly from the HD in the
> enclosure -- just like having a third internal HD slot but located
> externally.
>
> In my previous posts I described how I have used this setup for the
> last 2 years. While it doesn't support an "instant" re- boot, I can
> re-boot into the external HD or the second internal slot HD in the
> time it takes for my computer to do a re-boot -- generally under one
> minute.
>
> ======================================================.
> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
> news:us6uuf8ELHA.2276@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> It would be helpful to know the make and model of your motherboard and
> your BIOS version.(If this information is in another post, I didn't
> see it.)
>
> Cloning a drive and making it a bootable choice in real time is
> ordinarily an easy task. But if your external eSATA enclosure is
> hooked
> up via USB rather than via the SATA connection (which would be the
> case
> if your motherboard does not support eSATA), you have a very different
> situation.
>
> Or is your goal disaster recovery without the need for an *instant*
> boot (this method is preferred by people like day traders who can't
> afford a wasted second)? If so, creating an image of the drive would
> serve that purpose because once the image is restored, you will wind
> up with a bootable drive anyway.
>
> bobster wrote:
>> OOPS,
>>
>> Previous post should have read, That quote was from a post by "Paul",
>> not Paul Taylor
>>
>> "bobster" <fauxie@bogus.net> wrote in message
>> news:i005j9$tcc$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>> Sorry, Dave, that quote was from a post by Paul Taylor.
>>
>> My hardware configuration is described in another post on this topic.
>> It is an all SATA3 setup including an eSATA external enclosure for a
>> third drive.
>>
>> =================================================
>> "Daave" <daave@example.com> wrote in message
>> news:uPilsu6ELHA.4120@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>> bobster wrote:
>>> Daave,
>>>
>>> You said,
>>>
>>>> "If you plug a usb hard drive
>>>> in and reboot, it does not see the drive until XP has loaded. Too
>>>> late to boot it.

>>
>> No, I didn't say that. I said this:
>>
>> People have had mixed success with making ordinary USB external hard
>> drives bootable (it's rarely recommended). The motherboard and BIOS
>> must support the method and you would need to configure the BIOS
>> correctly.
>>
>> The easiest way to do this is to use an eSATA hard drive (of course
>> the motherboard must support eSATA).
>>
>> How about telling us about your hardware?
 
Top